If you don't go to college, you're not going to be anything. We're trying to change that mentality for a lot of these younger high school kids. I'm going to take this 6 to8 weeks of schooling. It's going [music] to get paid for and on the back end, I'm going to have a job for at least 2 years. Take them all the way to the watering hole, pour them a cup, and hand it to them. That's how we make all those connections.
How are you working with schools to [music] create this pathway for high school students to become crane operators? From South Bend to Evansville and everywhere in between, this is Get In, the show focused on the Hooser State and the incredible stories happening here today. I'm Nate Spangle, founder of Get Indiana, and I will be your host for today's conversation. [music] My guest today is Luke Humphrey, and he is the chief executive officer of Train for the Crane, [music] a construction training company based in central Indiana that helps prepare candidates for crane [music] operations, rigging, signaling, inspection, certified lift director work, and OSHA training. Through train for [music] the crane, Luke is helping develop skilled trades talent while emphasizing safety, certification, and workforce development [music] across the construction industry. Everyone knows that trades are at an all-time I think they're at an all-time need and are starting to gain in popularity.
I'm really excited to dive into how y'all [music] started this trade school, how you're getting people jobs. At the end of the day, you're helping people get skilled up in all things [music] related to cranes and how they're going out there and making careers of it. Luke, welcome to the show. Yeah, I appreciate you having me. Man, this is uh this is going to be a fun one. It it's different.
Sometimes we have on nonprofit leaders, sometimes we have on athletes or finance executives getting to talk about one just blue collar. Like it'll be it'll be a fun episode that I think will be enlightening to a lot of people to learn about the the need that is out there for the trades. So, first off, I got to know like what what did you build your career doing? Yeah. So, um appreciate you guys having me. Um I started my career in construction.
um kind of did pretty much everything in construction. Uh working my way up through the trades. Like did you out of high school did you have to go to a trade school or did you just kind of pick up experience on the job? Yeah, I I definitely took a a roundabout approach. Uh went went the traditional college route to begin with. That necessarily wasn't a great fit for for me at that time.
Where'd we end up at? ISUS. Yeah. You know, we were having ourselves a time. Okay. Yeah, we were having a good time for sure.
Um, so did that for a couple years, but was also working in construction. And you know, pretty quickly I realized like, hey, I'm making as much money doing this as what I would coming out of college. So I just kept doing that. Took some time off from college. Um, you know, eventually found my way into building water tanks. There's a a company based out of Indiana that builds water tanks.
I I started working there. I ended up finishing my uh college degree. You know, it took me about 10 years. [laughter] Hey, but I got it done. But you got it done. Yep.
Got it done. So, um through that time uh building water tanks, I moved into the safety side. I got my degree done and they moved me over there and that's pretty much how I got started in construction. Yeah. And so I I spent several years doing that and learned a significant amount about cranes and safety and you know just overall construction safety through that time. Yeah.
What got you interested in cranes or where did cranes start to become a part of this? Yeah. So cranes were are are heavily involved in building of of water tanks and when that was all coming, you know, that timeline all matched up pretty well where I was coming into that and learning a lot about that industry and there were um a significant amount of federal OSHA regulations that were changing around cranes. In short, you can think of it as someone that runs a crane, they need a driver's license, or essentially the same thing as a driver's license. It's a nationally accredited um credential. Like before though, let's say it was like 2005.
What did you need to operate a crane? Nothing really. Experience. It's kind of crazy to think about like cuz somebody just had to be like tossed the keys and said, "All right, now get that thing up there." Yeah. Yeah.
Couple million dollar pieces of equipment and hey, here's the keys. You know how to run that? Sure. Here you go. No way. So when did the new regulations get kind of put into place?
Yeah. um very end of it started in like 2010 but it federally went required at the very end of 2018 you know okay OSHA doesn't move very fast in a lot of ways so um it took them quite a while and that all that whole timeline just really matched up whenever I was getting heavily involved in the water tank industry and and the crane you know world so I had experience running cranes working around cranes. Then I started learning all the safety side of cranes and lift director and putting together lift plans and all the stuff for cranes from a safety side at the same time that these regulations were changing. And that all just kind of matched up. So the the short version of that aspect is is as this was coming together and I see all this happening, I I look at these regulations and I go, well, I want to be that guy. I want to be the guy that can do those certifications and provide that training because I could tell at the very onset, hey, there's not very many people doing this.
There there can't be. It's a new thing. And so that's really how I found my way into into that. There's a little more of a backstory as to um why I'm so passionate about it. Well, the good news is this is this is a place for stories. So, what gets you so passionate about cranes?
Yeah. So my story on on on the passionate level of it was um as a safety professional with that um company uh that that worked with cranes, we had an accident. Oh no. And um it was part of my job to explain to the family that hey your father's not coming home. And and that really changed me. It it it it really affected how I looked at things there.
So there was an accident with a crane. Mhm. And you were the safety director. Y Oh no man. Yeah. So you know up until that point I had um I guess u a narrower understanding of right and wrong for this industry.
Essentially what I thought we were doing was by the book and good and perfect and we're safe. But as that unfolded, it really became clear of like, hey, we're cutting a lot of corners. We're not necessarily doing this as safe as you could do it. And I think that is a thing uh in bluecollar just in general, whether it's, you know, working on a farm or you're working at a construction site. Sometimes it seems as though there is uh two forces working against each other from like the OSHA and safety side and the like efficiency get [ __ ] done. Yeah.
We got to make money. Yeah. Yeah. And those don't always work in tandem and then [clears throat] it's like but then you have something horrible that happens and you're like oh like even though it slows people down or you you aren't as efficient like someone's life is worth way more than getting this project done you know a day earlier or whatever it is. Yes. Exactly.
So, you know, as that unfolded and I I, you know, became, you know, heavily involved with, hey, let's try and make these changes so this never happens again. I don't ever want to tell another family that, you know. So, as that unfolded, I realized, hey, there's a lot of stuff that, you know, the company I worked for at the time, you know, hey, that we could make improvements to. And you know this isn't any different than than a lot of large companies but you know the answers that I received at that time was well we can't afford to do that. You can't afford not to do it either because if if you continue to have these type of accidents and you know cost us this amount of money you know you can only absorb one or two of these type of accidents and the whole company goes under. So, um, as that unfolded, it really just became clear to me that I had developed a skill set that, you know, was a very niche, you know, skill set.
I knew a lot about cranes and I knew a lot about safety for cranes. And as these regulations changed, I wanted to be someone that could teach, you know, frame industry safety regulations, how to operate safely, how to eventually that developed into helping people get credentials. Yeah, this is where I'm curious. How does it go from, you know, you're a subject matter expert, and that's great. You could be a mentor to new employees coming up. You can like do this.
you can be a trainer, you know, at at your previous company. How does it go from being a mentor to like, oh, I'm going to start a trade school? You know, as this all started to develop and and I started getting these credentials to be able to provide the training and do all that, you know, I I started realizing, hey, there there's a huge demand in in this industry. I started getting contacted, hey, can you come train our people? And it started with working for large companies, you know, Fortune 500 companies in, you know, oil and gas industry, power utility industries, those type of industries, because the people that work at in those industries, they require a lot more safety training. And I'm sure you walk in a safety presentation suit, the average person, and they're like, "Okay, like we'll just sit here and like look at you until it gets over."
But when you have someone that like can talk from experience like hey uh I've been on the worst end of this like trust me what I'm about to say is going to make an impact like give me 30 minutes or 60 minutes of your time. Yeah. Yeah. it and in and again there was some there's some just fortunate ways that things aligned with hey all these regulations are changing and essentially the industry crane industry as a whole is kind of scrambling to figure out well how do we meet these newer OSHA regulations and so whenever I presented to them hey I can help your people you know I can help you get through this certification process um it opened a lot of doors for us to to be able to do that. So, we started, you know, working business to business. We still do that.
But then it became uh a thing where all right, well, we have this this individual who's graying in the industry um a little bit older. Do we want to spend x amount of dollars to train that person or do we want to hire a new person with these type of credentials? And it and it's a good blend, right? But how the trade school started, which was your question, was we also found that, hey, these companies also want to hire, they need to hire certified people. You know, getting those credentials in the door and then keeping them there is a big hurdle for these bigger companies. So we started the trade school um using our skill set to help people get certified and all the connections that we have in the industry to where you know we can you know train someone and then help them find a job get a better higher paying job and you know that's something that's been a really cool passionate thing for us.
Yeah, it's like, you know, the obviously the upskilling and training on safety, but then also almost like the career services side of like helping them land cuz like what are the types of companies like let's say Indiana employers that are employing crane operators? Yeah. Large construction companies um you know those are the main ones that are in need. Yeah. um like what kind of need like you know how many are we you know hundreds of crane operators short like what is the need there that you guys are seeing? Yeah.
And it's hard to put a number on it. Um I would say it's easily in the thousands. Wow. So like if you get certified to operate a crane, you are incredibly employable. Correct. And so so I'll break it down like this.
Um, currently in Indiana, 71% of the workers that are working as a certified crane operator are 50 plus years old. So there is a huge cliff uh that exists in I mean that's you know in Indiana but also nationally where it's they're calling it a grain workforce. 71% of crane operators in the state of Indiana are over 50 years old. 50 or older. Yeah. And like generally what's the average salary of a crane operator?
Yeah, in Indiana average is around $80,000 a year. So like 71% over 50, you come in, you know, even if you make 70 grand as a 20-year-old kid, 21, you're you're doing all right. You're doing all right. Yeah, absolutely. Where are the are there like geographic pockets where a lot of them are or like is it anywhere spread out? Yeah, I mean it, you know, crane industry is pretty pretty wide base there, but you do have um you know, pockets obviously central Indiana that we have a ton of infrastructure projects in Indianapolis right now.
You know, Lily's building a huge project out in Lebanon, Indiana. And then my buddy Tyler uh Piper, he operates a crane out of Breamman, Indiana, and he is like job security. Oh, yeah. Like, you know, he he just actually got pulled into a festival. Okay. Okay, talk about a wild way for a crane to be used.
But they were wanted to hoist the largest American flag or like a huge American 160ft American flag, I think it was. And he's like, "Yeah, they rent us out for a day of work and me and another crane like lifted this thing up in the sky and just hung out all day. Just just hang out at the festival." That's America right there. That's right. So, it's like that's that's really interesting.
So, are you bringing in then a lot of are they net new like hey I graduated high school and I want to be a crane operator or it's like uh I have a construction job maybe I'm a laborer and I want to advance my career. Yeah. Um we get a lot of of what we call kind of second career Yeah. type guys and and women, but um where you know 25 to 30 it, you know, somebody may have not known exactly what they wanted to do out of high school. And we get a lot of those individuals um that want to change a career. Um they maybe they started in construction as a brick layer or laborer and they don't want to do that for 30 years.
And then we also have put a large um focus on on schools. Um there's a lot of changes going on with within Indiana and just career pathways in high school. Yeah. Yeah, with the whole like diploma changes and stuff like they're really putting a big push on apprentichips and the trades and and I mean there's a whole thing and you can say right wrong or indifferent but it felt like through the 2000s and 2010s like the only way you would ever be any sort of successful is if you went to college. It's like either you either go to college or accept that you're not going to be successful. We found that that is not true.
Correct. you know, lots of business owners, lots of, you know, you can make a really good living with a construction company. You can make a really good living with a fleet of trucks or a fleet of cranes, you know, like there. And I think that there's like a resurgence of blue collar is pretty sexy, you know, like you don't have to sit in an office all day and worry about AI taking your job. Like, you know, you're out there swinging hammers. Uh, that's tough for a robot to do that at at this current moment.
resurging workforce there. So you talk about identifying like okay the issue we need to solve is we need to get more young people interested in the trades. So how are you working with schools to create this pathway for uh high school students to become crane operators? Yeah. So, we have a couple different avenues with that. Um, you know, we can help, um, you know, within the schools.
There's a lot of schools that we've gotten, you know, connected to that are already implementing this pathway where, um, you know, there's a a group of schools out of Fort Wayne, Indiana, and they're they have a pathway that they're doing their senior year. It can start as a junior, but mainly as a senior in high school, and they can um do 600 hours of, you know, like an apprenticeship on the job type of training that also goes towards their their graduation credit hours. So, they're at, you know, at this point when we got involved, you know, they're building houses in their community that way. And, you know, I I simply as you need a crane sometimes. Well, yeah, of course they do. you know, to lift rafters and work on a roof and and all of that.
So, we were able to, you know, kind of get in that way with, hey, you know, this is a whole career path that that we can help, you know, your students with if you have interested parties there. Yeah. So, we um put together uh we call it um a below the hook or crane rodeo where we'll bring a crane to the school. you know, any kid that that may be interested in doing it, hey, come out and hang out with us for the day. You know, we're just in the parking lot and, you know, we get kids that are interested in it and then um we're giving a the winners of that crane crane rodeo that What do they have to do? Yeah.
It's like a obstacle course essentially driving a crane. Uh operating it through an obstacle course. Now, we're standing there and we're helping them so that there's no no issues. Um, but they'll operate a crane through an obstacle course and then we, you know, talk to them. Hey, would you like to do this pretty much all day every day and make, you know, 80 maybe $100,000 a year? Yeah.
Yeah. I really like this. This seems like it'd be for me because, you know, the traditional path that you mentioned earlier that that's my kind of age group as well is like, hey, you know, if you don't go to college, you're not going to be anything. and we're trying to change that, you know, mentality for a lot of these younger high school kids, second chance type of individuals. So, yeah, we operate a crane u a crane rodeo and then we're actually um giving grants from our own self to these kids to come to the program for free. Wow.
so that we're, you know, getting into those markets and getting people to know, hey, there's a whole another industry here. If, you know, Johnny from your local high school went to our program and next year you run into Johnny and you know, hey, how you doing? Well, I'm making 80 grand a year. Well, you're $40,000 in debt going to college. So, there's a difference. You know, it's not it's not the same path for everyone.
and just trying to change that. How long is the program? Like what does it take to go from I've never touched I've never been in a crane to now I'm operating it and I'm certified. Yeah, this is a this is a really fun topic because the traditional path um you know before you know groups like like Train for the Crane like us got involved the traditional path was all through uh the union which there is a great you know benefit to being in the union. Um but that traditional path um hasn't necessarily morphed with the times. And what I mean by that is um in that traditional path, let's say Nate, you want to be a crane operator and you go the traditional path through a union on average that that is going to take you about 18 months to get into the crane.
And so what are you doing for those 18 months? Yeah. So it's part of the apprentichip program. So, you would be going, you know, doing training, um, you know, trying to be involved and and trying to find work. But if they don't have work for you, they just don't call you and you're sitting at home. But in that 18 months, they may still be able to pull you out, put you as a rigger, you know, have you come to the apprenticeship, you know, facility, work on your training and all of that.
Um, but it's still 18 months. And in in today's world, there's much more of a need for instant gratification. I want to get this done as quick as possible. And our program, what it takes them to do in 18 months, we can do in 6 weeks. So, we have drastically expedited the timeline to get someone prepared to go out on a job. Now, that doesn't necessarily mean that they're going to be the greatest crane operator in the world.
They still don't have experience, right? And so we take them and and you know prepare them and get them ready to go out onto the job and give you know help them get through the certification processes to be a certified signal person be a certified rigger and be a certified crane operator. So it makes them as versatile as possible to you know walk into a crane company, a big construction company, even all the way down to small companies that are like roofing and framing. they still require a certified crane operator. Well, if if a candidate or individual walks in with those credentials already, it just makes them so much more hirable. Yeah.
You know, the company themselves doesn't have to invest thousands of dollars into them to get them, you know, credentialed and certified to do the job that they want. So it just expedites that timeline, you know, by a significant amount to be able to have them prepared to go out on a job in essentially 6 weeks. We say that we can pretty much, you know, get anyone through that and find them a job in 2 months and, you know, it takes them 18 months, the the older traditional pathway. Wow. Okay. And then are you helping make introductions for them uh once they go through the course?
Yeah. So, so we, you know, help them, we learn them, you know, help them learn all of the the training and how to run the crane safely, how to set it up, how to operate in the blind, all these, you know, fundamentals that are important from a safety factor. And then the back half of the of it is, um, you know, with our team, we're hey, what do you want to do? Do you do you want to go try and make the maximum amount of money? Well, then here's here's all the resources. You should apply for this job.
We have trade partners, right? All these companies that that we know are needing certified people. So, we set them up with kind of a a path that fits them, right? Cuz it's different for everyone, right? What makes the difference between whether you make 80 grand and whether you make a 100,000? like what are what would the differences be?
Give you an example, right? Like, okay, Nate, I don't know if you have a family or not, but if you do, you know, maybe at 35 plus years old and um, you know, two kids at home, maybe going to Texas and working is maybe not the pathway for you. But if you're an 18, 19, 20 year old kid that really has no ties, you know, doesn't necessarily um, you know, tied down to anything, then some of our trade partners will take them out of state and and provide them with different opportunities. Yeah. So, it's really about trying to connect with each individual on what what's the right path for you. Do you you know, you want to stay local, you want to stay working around here, you got a family you need to support, well, then here's all the resources.
Yeah. Yeah, Indiana Department of Workforce Development is a huge resource for us. We're able to connect with them on, you know, where's your demands, what companies are looking to hire these type of individuals and then, you know, basically set them up with interviews. Um, we help them with their resume. We, you know, lead them, our joke is like, hey, we take them all the way to the watering hole, pour them a cup, and hand it to them. They still have to do the interview themselves.
they still have to, you know, put their best foot forward and and do those things, but that's how we make all those connections. Yeah. What are the right skill set or personality traits that you're looking for in students that are coming through your guys' program? One of the biggest things that we see is just a a strong work ethic is what we need. Um, we can teach and and have someone learn all the the real, you know, brass tax and skills that is required to be a crane operator, but, you know, there still has to be a strong work ethic, right? Construction starts at 7:00 a.
m. , sometimes earlier, you know what I mean? Uh there's there's some things that we're looking for when we're talking to all the high school kids and and reaching out to those um people about, you know, well, what have you done in the past, you know, and what's your work ethic look like? Um you know, still we still have some interesting things that happen, right? Um, but it we're looking for someone that is is willing to learn to learn a trade that they can stay with for the rest of their career. Um, but kind of some of our jokes are, well, you know, if you show up on day one in Crocs, you you're not thinking of this correctly from a career trajectory, right?
Because the construction world is work boots, you know, high viz, hard hat, you know, all of those things. So, you know, look the part and then become the part, right? Yeah. So, that's part of Yeah. What advice do you have for maybe high school students out there or college or maybe they're that age and they're trying to figure out like what the heck am I supposed to be doing with life and and obviously some of them, you know, you guys are bringing them through the train for the crane program, but other ones are just trying to figure out like I don't want to go to college, but like where do I start and and how do I get a career versus just a job? A lot of what we're telling them is, you know, what are what is your goal?
you know, do you um do you want to be an entrepreneur? Okay. Well, then this there's a career pathway for this, right? You get these licenses, you get these certifications. And we've had several students come through our program and and go start their own tree company because they have, you know, the ability uh to to go do things like that. Yeah.
And it's like I mean if you had the certs and you had like a good sales engine to like start your tree company. You rent to start out you rent some a crane from somebody or rent the right you know machinery from somebody. You go out there you do that a few times. You save up some money. You get to buy your own at some point. You get your own tree truck.
Like that's for sure. Like that's not that crazy. And I mean I don't know a single personally that's ever done that. But I know that there is a need for that. Yeah, there is. Um, so, you know, we're we're willing to, you know, kind of help anyone that wants to, you know, get into this program um and help them steer a pathway that that fits them because it is typically different for everyone, right?
And depending on age, location, what they want to do, there's there's just such a demand that, okay, hey man, you want to run, you know, get your own truck and and have a tree company in your little small area of of Indiana? Great. Here's how you do that. You know, we'll lay out a plan for them. We'll lay out a structure for them and and try to help them achieve that. Wow.
Where are the places like Okay, so obviously one, what's the different sizes of cranes? Cuz the other piece I think about is like somebody's got to be operating like there's a bunch in Lafayette right now. Like someone's got to be operating those those big suckers like Yeah. Yeah. That that's a that they're you know they make cranes that are you know capable of picking up you know 500 tons plus actually. But um you know the we try to stick to getting people into a crane that they're going to start in because no matter what credentials you have, you still need time to learn the ins and outs.
And you don't start with the 500 ton crane and the stuff that you see in Fort Wayne right now. you start on smaller and you kind of gain that experience of working with, you know, midsize cranes. So, it goes from, you know, 500 ton plus all the way down to, you know, um, a 10 ton boom truck that, you know, can pick up, you know, tree limbs and stumps and all those kind of things. So, it's a wide range. What's the smallest crane? Um, I mean, there's a 4 ton Broersen crane that that works in industrial plants quite a bit.
Um, but typically that, you know, five to eight ton range is about as small as you're going to see. Okay. And what would you use those for? Yeah. In in the industrial plants, um, you know, they're using those to do maintenance work and and, you know, new construction work within those plants where they're pulling pumps and motors and and I got you. Okay.
You know, stuff that's not as easy or not as safe with a forklift or teleah handler, those types of equipment. Yeah. Okay. Wow. Okay. So, you guys started Train for the Crane in 2017?
Yeah, started in towards the end of 17. Really, we didn't officially do much until 2018. Okay. So, and now how many how many people have gone through and got certified through the Train for the Crane program? Yeah, we lost count somewhere. It It's definitely over a thousand.
That's That's incredible. Yeah. But there's still a huge need for more people to get certified. Oh yeah. Yeah. You know, there the biggest need is just the future tints of the need, right?
Um where there's, you know, somewhere in the ballpark, you see all kinds of numbers, but five to 10 leaving the industry for retirement for every one new person coming in. Oh boy. Well, it doesn't it's not going to take forever for that to get really, you know, out of line where the demand is so high. I think there's some positives to that though because um you know what we're saying now as we've talked about here that kind of the average is around 75 80 grand. I will be surprised if in the next 5 to 10 years that that doesn't go up significantly because there'll just be more of a demand. the more grade operators as they decide to take their retirement.
It's like, hey, now we need to we need to, you know, uh, bring on more workers in the space. It's kind of like electricians right now. I feel like I just saw a thing that it's like with all the data centers that are popping up, there's like a 100,000 electrician shortage across the country. It's like, do the only thing is like the good the best of them will continue to be worth more value. And you have the same thing happen if 71% of crane operators in the state of Indiana are over the age of 50. Like do the math.
Like we got to get some young crane operators in there. And like talk there's way worse ways to spend a day like than operating a crane. Oh yeah. Yeah. It's not physically taxing, you know, most of the time. Talk about uh finances.
Like how does someone graduate high school? Maybe they don't have, you know, any money. Yeah. And they're looking for a job and they're trying to figure out what they do. Like, how do they afford getting their crane certification? We have a ton of different options.
Um, you know, from whether or not someone wants to, hey, I don't want any debt. I want to do it myself. You know, we, you know, structure payment plans. We have our own financing department for someone that that may have struggles that way. But then I mean there are all kinds of benefits for or getting into the industry. Um a qualifying veteran uh so spent time in the military has post 911 GI bill um they are eligible to come through our trade school for no cost out of pocket to themselves.
Wow. The vet the VA will pay. How did you guys get certified or like I'm sure that was a challenge to become a recipient of Yeah. I mean really it just comes back to we are providing a accredited um you know credential that will help this individual find a job. So when someone leaves the military and they may or may not know what they want to do but you've heard of all kinds of programs like um you know helmets to hard hats program is one you know um those type of programs are trying to help veterans. So getting involved with those type of programs and then getting through, you know, VA approvals, um it just helps, you know, bring people in and helps them find jobs.
So, but you ask about the the financing part of it. I mean, we can finance someone to come through the school um for very very low cost. Um but our, you know, standard cost for our program is between $8,500 and $10,000. and that you're with us for somewhere between, you know, four to eight weeks depending on, you know, what all they want to do. Um, so, you know, their total, you know, financial impact. Let's just pick an easy number and say it's $10,000.
In round it off to call it two months. So, in in two months, they'll have incurred $10,000 worth of debt. They can pay that back off if they're smart about it. in the next two months of the job that they find. You know what I mean? If they're a young kid, doesn't have a lot of bills.
Yeah. You know, if they were smart about it, they and even and even if you maybe you life you have life, it's like you could probably if let's say you go from 60 grand a year to 80 grand a year. Yeah. Like you could pay it off in a year. Yeah. Yeah.
Our we can finance the thing whole all the whole thing out over two years. Um but we we're able to get through Indiana Workforce Development. And I mean there's all kinds of grants that can help people. Um and and we do all of that as well. You know, somebody wants to come in and they don't know, right, that how am I going to pay for this? How much does it cost?
All of those type of things. You know, our first questions are all right, you know, what's your age? Um almost like uh you remember the old FASA form from college, right? So it a lot of the same type of similar type of questions of you know um you know family's financial situation and like maybe even like current wage cuz like if you're upskilling you're hey we're creating a more sophisticated workforce it's going from hey you can make 40 grand a year to 80 grand a year or 100 grand a year and it's like oh yeah like the delta and that makes sense to for the state the the department of workforce development to invest into something like that. Exactly. Exactly.
you nailed it. So, that's um it's really a huge difference and and that's one of our, you know, kind of selling points is, hey, you can invest, like I said, round it off, call it $10,000 with us and you will get and receive these credentials and you'll be capable of getting these jobs that pay this amount. So if you take that and look at it from a macro level, you know, or you can go to college, you might rack up 75, 80, $100,000 in debt and come out of there, love teachers, but they don't pay them enough, right? And and so you might go rack up that amount of debt and then come out and get, you know, a job paying $45, $50,000 a year. Lot we need a lot of those people, but we also need a lot of people in the crane industry. and we can help them get a higher paying job.
Yeah. Wow. So, fraction of the cost and you know somewhere in the ballpark of 50% higher wages. Now, where's the coolest project that one of your students have gone on to work for? Like has there been like a blue chip where it's like, oh yeah, like we like to talk about Robert. Robert ended up, you know, putting the needle on the Space Needle or whatever.
We've had a lot of workers um you know working on the Lebanon project here in in Indiana and then we've had a few that have done some really cool stuff out in the New York City. There's a huge demand for for you know credentials out there. So they've done some really cool projects. Um you know I had a a younger kid you know send me some pictures uh working with a crane on Wall Street you know in a in a very fun roundabout way. That's cool. That's pretty cool.
But one of our biggest um you know, opportunities that we present is working with, you know, some very very large uh you know, corporate construction companies. You know, uh Kiwit as an example, they're they're a large one of the largest construction companies in the United States. And you know, we hear some crazy numbers from them. you know, hey, we need and some crane operators on this next project. Where are we going to get them? I don't know where you're going to get 120 of them, but you can start with us.
You know, we can get you, you know, 10 this month. We can get you six this next month, and we can try and, you know, really place people into really good corporations and really good companies. So we tried to sell the idea as hey you know if you like this and you want to continue with this this is a career not a job. Now are any of the companies willing to like pick people before and say hey we're like kind of sponsoring John's uh crane credentials. So like we'll give them the $10,000 on it on the contingency they work for us for two years or whatever. Oh yeah.
It's kind of like the NBA route if you ever know like you know Lily does that where hey we'll pay you I mean that's like 200 grand or whatever it is. It's like we'll we'll give you 200 grand to put into your MBA on the pre on the premise that you'll come back and work for us for 3 years or whatever it is. Yeah. Exactly. There's a lot of uh the big companies that we work with that are that are doing that structuring that you know usually they're like hey sign this two-year contract or or whatever. So like going into it, you're let's say you're 20 years old and you're like, "Okay, well I know I'm going to take this 6 to8 weeks of schooling.
It's going to get paid for and on the back end I'm going to have a job for at least 2 years." Like well and and the biggest selling point there is, you know, when we put people and send people down that path, we hope that they stay there, we know that they're good companies. We know that they're going to, you know, they get all these good benefits, they get, you know, higher paying jobs and all that. But hey, it may not be for you forever, right? You may not want to do that, you know, pathway forever. But if you go and work for these big companies and you get two years of experience plus your credentials, plus you have no debt or shouldn't have and you've gained all this experience running all this different type of equipment, you know, high-end equipment, you can go back home, you can go wherever and you're going to get a job because you are the prototypical candidate that any of these companies would be looking for.
You've got the credentials, you know, you've got your head on straight. you've worked for this, you know, highlevel construction company and you've got the experience, you're in. That's awesome, man. I love it. Um, I think that it's definitely identifying a need. Again, I just keep going back to the 71% of crane operators in the state of Indiana are over 50 years old.
Like, clear need. We got to now build this pipeline for more people looking to whether it's reinvent their second career or coming out of high school and they're like I don't want to go to college but I don't know what I want to do. How do you get them plugged into all things crane? Um I think that's so so cool. Uh we have come to the part of the show where we get to talk all things Indiana. Um so this question is brought to you by our friends at JC Hart.
They're a leader in creating enjoyable living experiences at apartment communities all across Indiana and beyond. Check them out at homejcart. com. I'm sure they also need cranes. Yeah. When you're building apartment communities, like there's no shortage of need for cranes there.
My question for you, why do you call Indiana home? Yeah. Um I was born and raised in in Terode, Indiana. Um so, you know, hooer through and through. Um spent, you know, a good chunk of my early career, you know, traveling around the country. Um you know, essentially chasing work.
And um when I had the opportunity to move back home uh to Indianapolis area, you know, that's where I always wanted to raise a family, you know, being close to family, being close to, you know, the bluecollar heart of America that that I came from. Yeah. And so, yeah, I've uh landed on Indiana as home and, you know, raising a family here and and, you know, it's a very affordable place to live and, you know, it presented me with some opportunities that um, hey, there's not really anybody else doing what I'm doing here in Indiana. So, this is this is perfect. And there, you know, not a not a huge competition, excuse me, not a huge, but a huge need. Yeah.
But a huge need. So, so whenever I kind of put all those pieces together, it's like I'm going home. Yeah, I love that, man. That's so so cool. Um, okay. I want to know this about the construction and like trade space.
So, obviously you need certifications to get to be a crane operator. What's like the mo What's like the craziest bluecollar job? Like what's the one where it's like you have to have some serious schooling credentials, certifications, but is like a very well like wellto-do bluecollar job like the the most like weird out there like oh yeah the these guys are crazy. Yeah, I I would probably say that the the iron workers and and steel workers are are are probably still, you know, pretty high on that list. Um you know, we work, you know, pretty closely with them. They would be in the foundaries like in places like that like the steel mill.
Yeah, steel mills. Um, you know, or just, you know, building the higher, you know, skyscraper type buildings, you know, oh, they're like the ones that are like up on the walking around on the beams and and old school picture of the Empire State Building where they're eating lunch out there and it's like, dude, you start to do the math and like you look up the and it's like so many people fell from that building back in the day. Yeah. It's like that was an OSHA nightmare. Absolutely. Like that's crazy.
So yeah, those are still some of the like the the the kind of crazy type of of of of the construction industry. You know, those those individuals uh kind of cut from a different cloth if they're going to be walking around up there. Um and I kind of, you know, talk about that. Hey, I'd rather be the guy on the ground running the crane handing them the stuff. Yeah. Right.
[laughter] Than I want to be the one up there walking around putting it together. Yeah. The iron workers and the steel workers. That's a good one. Okay. Is it hard to operate a crane?
Yeah. Whenever you start, you're very very cautious to not make a mistake. And and that's good. You want to be cautious. You want to be safe. You always want to play it safe.
Every once in a while, we get a candidate that, you know, maybe ran some equipment, you know, ran a ran something on a farm somewhere and and has a little bit more of comfort level with the controls. But [clears throat] in in today's world and with all the cranes um that are being manufactured these days, we explain it to to younger generation, you like video games, it's like running a video game, you know, not all cranes, but in where this is going in the future, I mean, it's joysticks, you know, you got to be able to read the computer screens and decipher, you know, math on the computer screen to equate to what that physical load weighs out that you're picking up. Wow. So, so you know with this next generation that's coming into the industry, we are presenting it to them as a you know we have a crane simulator. You know, it's all computerized and outside of some feel type of things that you would feel physically on a crane is very very accurate and it's basically a big computer game.
So um you need to you know have um some ability on technology that that doesn't necessarily you unfortunately doesn't always help that growing industry because you know that they came up from a different way and all of that wasn't in cranes until you know the last 10 15 20 years it's become more prominent. Yeah, the younger generation's going to have um some advantages over the older generation with the new style of cranes. Yeah. Oh, I can just see like Yeah. You know, being in the in the crane simulator and like, you know, working on getting a load up there like that's that's so that's so fascinating. That's so cool.
And like with technology, it's like oh, you can continue to put them in these situations and learn about what it feels like without having to go out there and, you know, set up a whole crane and make the thing happen. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. What's the most underrated skill someone in a bluecollar trade needs? Work ethic.
You you we can train people how the crane works. We can teach people how um you shouldn't do this because it's [clears throat] more unsafe to do it that way. Mhm. But at the end of the day, you know, you still have to be able to show up on time, put your time in, learn things, and, you know, be adaptable because every crane is a new situation every day. So, it's not the same old. Yes, you may be running the same crane, but if you moved it and set it up again, that's a whole new situation.
Yeah. So, so one of the most underrated skills is just being able to adapt to the everchanging environment that is a construction site. And it it's, you know, minute by minute it's changing and that's again something that we're trying to teach this younger generation. Yeah. Yeah. And and there's there's nothing wrong with the way that the way things always went, but from a safety perspective, this is the way we've done it for the last 20 years.
That's like one of the worst things I've ever heard because, well, just because you did it that way for the last 20 years. That's how y'all learned how to do it. That doesn't mean it's now the safest way. There's been a ton of changes over the last decade or two that now say, "Hey, there's a safer, better way to do it." So, we're trying to teach, you know, being more adaptable and flexible of, hey, this general contractor wants you to do it that way, then just do it that way. Don't worry about that's how you've done it the last 10 years.
You just do what they ask you to do and be very adaptable to, you know, what a contractor may want or how they want you to do it. as long as it stays within these safety parameters, you know, don't question everything cuz they have more knowledge about something than what you may have. Okay, we've come to the final three questions of the show where we get to talk all things Indiana. Uh this is your opportunity to shed some light on a part of the state that more people need to be talking about. Could be a park, a restaurant, anything like that. What is a hidden gem in Indiana?
I've kind of got a little bit of a nerd aspect to me in regards to architectural stuff and um you know putting up buildings and and some of that infrastructure. So I one of my hidden gems of Indiana is Columbus, Indiana. Yeah. And I'm sure you've I'm sure you've knew about it, but um you know, kind of some of my nerd aspect to that is Columbus, Indiana is consistently ranked in the top, you know, 10 in the country for architectural design up there with New York, San Francisco, and all of that. And the reason that is is it goes back to, you know, back in the 50s or so with Cumins. You know, they're huge in Columbus.
Um, but if you just drive around Columbus and look at the architecture of the buildings and you the government buildings, um, I mean, it's it's basically an open air museum of of really cool built buildings. And, you know, being a crane crane guy and kind of a crane nerd in those aspects, it's like, wow, they they really built that. Very cool. They really put some time into building that. And, you know, I noticed things like that. So, Columbus, Indiana is a pretty hidden gem in my my mind.
Yeah. I like looked to it to get some, you know, stats in general about it because it is a wild collection because some like very wellknown u architects have designed buildings and I'm not like I wouldn't know architects if you called them out, but like I know that they are well known that have gone through there. And actually, this is I mean a while ago, but in 1991, the American Institute of Architects rated Columbus sixth on its list of top 10 American cities for architectural quality and innovation. Like up there, Chicago, New York, San Francisco, and you have Columbus, Indiana. That's wild. Yeah, it's an interesting fact.
And and I just one of those things that I kind of always recognized and saw going through there. I was like, man, they got some really cool buildings here. I wonder how they built this. I wonder I wonder where they put the crane up to be able to do that. Those are things that I Yeah. Always comes back to training for the crane.
I love it. Okay, this is uh your opportunity to introduce us to someone that that more people need to be talking about. Who's a hooer we need to keep on our radar? Someone who's doing big things. Yeah. I um I'm going to have to give you a little bit of a homework answer on this, Nate, because um one of my business partners, her name is Megan Kurt, and she is the one that is really driving all these initiatives.
Um she's the the face, the name that's out there at these schools. Um you know, really changing this line of thinking within Indiana. you know, heavily involved with workforce development and heavily involved with all these schools across the state because there all of the schools are working on these programs, you know, to give pathways towards construction. It whether that's a hammer, you know, or or a crane still going that direction. So, she's really somebody that's flipping this on its head, right? There's we know about this demand.
uh we've talked about the grain industry, but then the gap is well how do all of the the hooers know that this program exists and Megan is the one that is going to be pushing that from our perspective. So, a little bit of a Homer answer, but she's the one that's um going to be known over the next 10 years by all of the Indiana con, you know, big construction companies because they're all going to need crane operators and they're all going to be trying to figure out, well, where do I get these people? How do I acquire this talent for the lowest cost? That's what large companies and corporations do. Absolutely. And so having her as a resource uh for all of those companies is only going to help those companies as time goes on.
So I really think that you know over the next handful of years um you know she's going to really make a name for herself and for Train for the Crane. Yeah. Um to expand what we're doing. I love it man. Luke this is your final question. So thinking about, you know, Terote, Indiana State to Danville, Central Indiana, Avon, Indianapolis, all over.
When you think back on your time as a Hooer, what is your favorite Indiana memory? I'm going to give you one that maybe you need to check out. All right. So, where where I grew up, um, have you ever heard of the Fountainet Bean dinner? No. Yeah, you got to check it out, man.
So, um, this is kind of where I grew up as a kid. It it it's really um it's close to the north end of Teroot and it's something that's gone on for I don't know the stats on it but maybe a hundred years or something crazy and essentially the entire community um comes comes together there and you know they they cook beans for the whole community in a big pot. But it was always like this crazy fun environment as a kid. you know, there was a bunch of, you know, people there and you knew everybody and, you know, you went there and and you just hung out for the day and you run around with all your cousins, all your friends, everybody from the school was there. And the way I remember it as a kid, there was like no adult supervision. You know, you're you're playing, you know, baseball, football, running around at the park there that they did it at.
And um it was always a really fun environment to go to. Wow. Okay. The Fontinet Bean Dinner. So each year, Fontina, Indiana enjoys the annual Fontet Bean Dinner Festival, a tradition stemming from a Civil War veterans picnic, first held in 1890. Wow.
The festival was originally held on land near the Dupont Powder Mill. After the mill exploded in 1907, the picnic moved to a new site on Baldwin Avenue. Uh yeah, the bean dinner grounds are located uh on North Baldwin Street in Fontnet. 2025 marked the 129th. Wow. So I think this will be the 130th year.
Yeah. Of the Fontinet Bean Dinner. Yeah. Some It was in August last year. I have not seen a date for 2026, but uh generally Oh, wow. It's like a usually held in the last weekend in August.
There we go. Look at that. That's a really good one. Yeah. What a heck of a memory. Yeah, man.
Luke, it's been uh it's been so fun to learn about, you know, your pathway, you know, college, 10 years to get a degree, working, chasing work all around, and finally figuring out that like, hey, man, helping people get these certifications and start careers. I think a lot of people maybe look at some some sort of uh, you know, these pathways as jobs, right? when you get to you get your certifications, you can build a career operating cranes, making good money, you know, uh I I just think that that gives people more of a purpose and and can, you know, take them from a brick layer to a crane operator. Man, it's incredible. If people want to learn more about Train for the Crane, if they want to learn more about all the stuff y'all are doing, how can they do that? Yeah, trainforthecane.
com. Um we're on all social medias um as train for the crane. um you can reach us there. And you know, just for all your viewers, um you know, we're here to try and help people. You know, we know that there's a demand in the industry and you know, if you're someone that might be thinking about a career change or just someone younger that that wants to get into construction, um you know, definitely look us up. We're we're we're going to do everything we can to, you know, help someone get those skills and then like as you said, find a career, you know, for the long term.
I love it, man. Well, great. Hey, thanks for stopping by and we'll talk to you soon. I appreciate you having me. This show is made possible by our friends up at Sweetwater. Whether you're looking to start a podcast or take your content to the next level, click the link in the description to see all my gear recommendations at Sweetwater.
If you want a behindthescenes look at everything we're doing across the state, make sure you follow me on Instagram and Tik [music] Tok @ Nate Spangle. Thank you so much for listening and being a part of what makes the Hooser State great. [music]