Why Former Indianapolis Mayor Greg Ballard Is Running for Indiana Secretary of State

I'm doing this because in 20 30 years from now, this thing has to be different. This office has to change and I'm the guy to do that. But the PR teams in the back like, "Dang, we didn't plan for this one." You wake up, you're the mayor. What do you do day one? 99.

7 of the articles were [music] positive. There were no bad articles about the Indianapolis Super Bowl. That's pretty impressive. Holy cow. Like where [music] was the first serious conversation where you said to someone, you know, I think I'm going to run for mayor? From South Bend to Evansville and everywhere in between, this is Get In, the show focused on the Who's Your State and the incredible stories happening here today.

I'm Nate Spangle, founder [music] of Get Indiana, and I will be your host for today's conversation. This summer, I'm exploring Indiana from top to bottom in a Rorman wrap tundra. Before I hit the road, I make sure my truck is ready, and you should, too. Rorman Auto Group [music] is making it easy right now. 50 bucks gets you a full synthetic oil and filter service, plus a complete multi-point inspection. [music] Tires, brakes, battery, suspension, fluids, they check it all, and your tech sends you a video walkthrough after.

[music] If you're road tripping the summer or just want your car running, this is a nobrainer. Find a participating Roman location near you and book it [music] today. Up to seven quarts plus tax and shop supplies cannot be combined with other offers. See dealer for full details. [music] Now, let's get into today's episode. Today's guest has one of the more unusual political biographies you'll find in the United States.

Now, Mayor Greg Ballard grew up in Indianapolis and he served 23 years in the United States Marine Corps, rising to the rank of Lieutenant Colonel. Then, he ran for mayor of Indianapolis with almost no name recognition and beat a sitting mayor. He served two terms as a 48th mayor of Indianapolis from January 1st of 2008 to January 1st of 2016. And now he's back, this time running as an independent for Indiana Secretary of State. Now, fun fact, he needed 37,000 petition signatures to get on the ballot. Something that no independent statewide candidate has pulled off in Indiana in the last two decades, and he was able to collect more than 74,000 signatures.

I'm really excited to dive into this episode. It's a special one. Mayor Ballard, welcome to the show. Thank you, Nate. Thanks for having me. Of course.

Wow. I mean to have a previous mayor, this is our first Indianapolis mayor, past or present, that have been on the show. I am honored for you to sit in studio with us today and I'm excited to learn more about your truthfully unorthodox political career that started here in the Circle City. I will say I am the uh the wrestling coach at Bishop Chitard High School and so we do have some uh disaligning values. You're a cathedral guy, right? Well, Chitaard is run by a cathedral guy.

Uh Bill S. Yeah, that's true. We let we let him get inside there. He was he was a year behind me and he's a great guy. He's done such a spectacular job. So So you grew up what part of Indianapolis?

Like what? Uh near northeast. Uh there's a little street called Randolph Street where I was born. But when I was very young, probably a year or so. We moved out to 3131 Arington Boulevard, which is 30th in Emerson area. Oh yeah.

When I was 12, we moved out to the 46th in Arlington uh Arlington area, which is Arlington High School. Yeah. So 4439 Campbell actually and then you ended up going to Cathedral. Now this is what I think is interesting about your journey. You you graduate from high school, you go down to IU, you get a degree and then you do something that's pretty uncommon and instead of going and working in finance or wherever else, you actually join the Marine Corps. Very unusual at the time because right after the Vietnam War.

Yeah. And not not the military is not in good repute at the time, if you will. But to be frank, I was uh I was not a bad kid. I was I didn't get in trouble, nothing like that, but I was unstructured. I was unmotivated. I just didn't know what to do, where to go, that sort of thing.

And I had about 90 hours down at IU. Uh nothing stellar. I I was actually pretty smart kid. And uh but I it didn't matter. I was when you're not motivated, right? So with about 90 hours done, I walked into the enlisted recruiting uh station in Bloomington.

And I didn't know the officer, the difference between officer enlisted. I didn't know much about the military. I just thought, well, gee, I'll just I'll go in and talk to the army and the air force and the navy. And I h they were busy. [laughter] They were busy. And the marine recruiter was lurking out there and he was a drill instructor, old drill instructor.

He had lost his voice. And I'm at the time, you have to imagine this, I'm like 6' tall. Uh, I think I was six foot by then because I grew up in I grew three inches actually in college. I was a lake grower. Lucky and I was probably 125, 130 lbs or something like that. And wait, six months.

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I was really really skinny. It was seriously skinny. And I [clears throat] I and uh he was he was lurking in the hallway. I was kind of waiting for the other services to open up and he comes up to me and says, [clears throat] "Want to talk about the gore?"

What? I was scared to death. Scared to death. I went into his office, stayed there two hours, never talked to the other services. Never did. And you know what he told me?

He said, "Get back in school. Get your 30 hours. Come in as an officer." The interesting thing about that is 15 year 15 years later, I am leading a recruiting station in St. Louis, Missouri. I had two I had two/3s of Illinois.

I had the eastern third of Missouri. And none of my recruiters would have told a young man that they would have signed him up on the spot. But that guy told me, "Go back to school, finish up, and come in as an officer." And that's what I did. No way. Oh, yeah.

One, I thought that when you heard his voice, you would have just signed on the spot right there out of [laughter] fear. Oh god. But you know, I I was in there for two hours. Wow. And I I was enthralled because he loved the core so much. Yeah.

And it was very evident. That's that's [clears throat] why I never talked to anybody else. Yeah. And so you then spend the next 23 years Well, not quite. It took me two more years to actually get those 30 hours, but two years later through another set of circumstances, you go back. I go back in and I go back up.

I'm in Indianapolis where the actually the officer selection piece is and I walked in and uh to the captain there and I said, "You don't know who I am, but all my background checks have been done. Uh I'm kind of ready to go." Yeah. And a month and a half later, I was on my way to Quanico, Virginia. Something wouldn't happen today. Why?

Like I want to know like in a time where you're getting to the end of uh this was the end of Vietnam. Like this was 78. 78. Okay. So, in a time where military sentiment is not very high, public service, it's like you have a degree now. You went back and did it.

You could go do any sort of career, like what was the thing that that sparked service to the military for you? My gut told me to do it in some way somehow. I I didn't really have structure beyond it. I I wasn't really I didn't really It's It's different then than it was today than it is today, right? I didn't interview for jobs. I didn't do this and this and this.

And I thought in the back of my mind was always this. Uh, it was so funny cuz I had taken so long and and it's it's public knowledge now. I don't mind saying it. I took six years in a summer. I mean, I You're like the super duper senior. I took freshman composition.

The first course you ever take in college, W131. I took that in that last summer, believe it or not, cuz I just sloughed it off. Right. Freshman show up and like, who's grandpa over here? I I took raet ball, you know, [laughter] you know, whatever it was to get to the number of hours I needed, 120 or whatever it was. But it's interesting you say you go from kind of like working your way through college to then like a pretty rigorous, intensely scheduled like the the Marine Corps or any armed service like you go straight to Quantico, Virginia where it's like I'm assuming some sort of boot camp.

Yeah, officer candidate school is actually a screening process but it's similar to boot camp but it's a different different focus. But I I went from no structure, hanging out, love Bloomington. I actually I told my dad I joined the Marine Corps. And he says, "What are you going to do about college?" I said, "Dad, I graduated." He goes, "I don't believe you."

My dad said he didn't believe me. And but I did. I had graduated. And I'd gone into that office in downtown Indianapolis. And like I say, a month and a half later, I was down in Quanico. And it was the first 3 or 4 days.

You think it'd be all hell breaking loose first time. That's what happens with boot camp. It does not happen officer candidate school cuz they do all your medical tests, all screening. Uh to make sure that you can handle whatever is coming at you. So 200 people were in our class. 110 made it.

Okay. 55% made it. Yeah. Because it's screening. It's not they don't care if you make it or not as an officer. They they want to make sure you have the capability to do that.

So, it was uh after 3 or 4 days of medical screening, if you will, and psychological screening, then all hell broke loose. Wow. And it was, as you saw at the movies at that point in time, including how you eat on those silver trays and they throw junk on your tray and uh no matter what you did, it was wrong. Uh push-ups all day long. I mean, it's just it was unbelievable. And uh I remember the second week, the second Thursday, I I sat on my foot log.

I said, "What what have I done? What have I done to myself here?" I remember thinking that exactly. Two or three more weeks and all of a sudden you start picking it up and there you go. Wow. That is that is wild.

What how did your time in the Marine Corps change you? Oh, so much. Uh mainly I I found this out later. I did not know this at the time, but I actually operate better within structure. I'm good in structure. I'm actually more creative in structure.

My mind [clears throat] works in structure. I did not know that at that age obviously but I I certainly know it now. So they provided that structure there. There was a way forward on all of this and I I actually thrived in after a while. I started to thrive in that structure. What what really helped as you go on after 23 years you learn so much and uh certainly made me more patriotic obviously.

You talk about the founding of the country and and the how the military plays into the overall strategy of the country. All those things came into play. It helped me in so many ways like focus. I I didn't know how to focus. I did I didn't Everything was so easy for me in school that I never studied. That's why I I floundered.

I didn't know how to study, frankly. And you know, Bloomington's a pretty fun place. So, but once you get in there, they don't take that. They don't care about that in the Marine Corps. You either make it or you don't. And if you don't, they throw you out.

So, I and I wanted to make it. I wanted to make it. And so, I so I buckled down. I found the structure and did those things. But, you learn how to focus, how to accomplish mission with people. They talk about leadership from day one.

Day one. It's just part and parcel of everything that we do. It had to work in teams and how to lead teams and things like that. And so it it just I just bought all of that and it made sense. It all made sense to me at that point in time and uh I stayed in 23 years. Yeah.

Well, 23 years including I mean one like tour of active duty in the Persian Gulf, right? Well, I was it was all active duty. Oh wow. So I was 23 years I lived around all around the world. is one you got um what do they [clears throat] call that when you get uh like sent overseas? Yeah, we got deployed a lot.

We were deployed I was deployed a lot but once in uh full war if you will Persian Gulf War back in 1991 when Saddam Hussein was burning those oil wells and he was trying to attack Kuwait to get the rema oil fields and all of that. I was right in the middle of all that. Um couple years before we did a little Noriega action in Panama. Not too not too much for me. Uh most of that action happened after I left Panama. But two years later, we're we're in uh in Saudi Arabia.

We were in the Gulf fighting that war. And you're a kid from Indianapolis. You know, you you then you ventured to the big school down in Bloomington, Indiana, and now all of a sudden you're in Virginia and around the world. Like what do you think you learned about the world? And what did you teach the world about Indiana while you were in the Marine Corps? The first thing is there is a world, [snorts] right?

Because on this show, this show's [laughter] just the state of Indiana. I get it. I get it. But you know, I never left the state of Indiana except for my brother's wedding in Toledo, Ohio when I was 16. That's the first time I left the state of Indiana, believe it or not. It was different back then.

We were we were we were modest means, I'll put it that way. And then I when I was at IU, I rode on the Little Five and one year we went to Florida to train over spring break. Other than that, I never left the state of Indiana until I joined the Marine Corps. really. I mean, that's how it was back then. At least the list it was for me.

But now I've traveled the world. I lived in I've lived in Asia a few times. I've lived a certain my last three years in Marine Corps in Europe. Uh I spent I lived uh lived in East Coast, West Coast. I I've traveled been in the war been obviously been to Panama. We traveled Asia.

My wife and I traveled to Asia quite a bit. We traveled to Europe obviously my last three years with the kids. So much. It's just a big world out there and sometimes you don't realize it. But you also in the Marines with increasing responsibilities, you learn how all these things work together. Uh what peace means, uh what war means and how all this interacts.

Wow. I can only imagine. I feel like we could do a whole entire episode just like on those first 23 years [laughter] of the Marine Corps. It was it was a good ride, frankly. So when did you what year did you get out of the Marine Corps? 2001.

Okay. When I got out. So I I went in in 78, the fall of 78, got out in 2001, came back home here cuz I wanted my kids to call Indianapolis their hometown. I was going to say like cuz when you're in active duty, you're not living in Indianapolis, you're living wherever you're stationed. All right. Yeah.

Yes. I uh first duty state after schooling in Quantico. Yeah. I went to California for three years and where and well three years in one place, two years in another in Barstow, but I met my wife in San Clement, California. Yeah. And then we got married in Barstow uh soon thereafter.

So I a lot of time there, four and a half years in Lune. I got back to the Midwest twice. Like I said, uh [clears throat] St. Louis, I was in Michigan actually for three years. But I was living I lived in Okinawa twice. I was in uh Germany.

Yeah. I I had a good run. I did. But you're you're all over. But then when the time came to, you know, move on to the next chapter of your life, you landed on coming back home to Indianapolis. What was the reason for that?

I wanted my kids to call Indianapolis their hometown and Indiana their home state. So, they had lived around the world. They they they kind of considered it that because we would come back on vacation occasionally and they see the see my Do you have siblings? And I got three older brothers and a younger sister. Yeah. Uh my parents were here.

Uh we grew up here and and my kids kind of knew that part of the family. Uh but I wanted them to really get to know that part of the family. I wanted them I wanted them to call Indianapolis their hometown and they did. after being gone relatively from from calling it your permanent home for 23 years. Actually, at that point it would have been 27 roughly because of college even more. You've been gone for a while.

What kind of Indianapolis did you return to when you looked around the city in the early 2000s? Like what was the landscape? I think for me it was good. It seemed pretty good to me actually. I I I was glad to have my kids uh here with us. I'm my mom here.

My dad actually died when I was in Germany. So, my dad wasn't here when when I retired and came back home. But all my brothers and sisters were in the area, not not necessarily in Indianapolis at the time. They are now uh but they were in different places, but they were nearby. So, they got we got the family aspect down really really well. And I think I thought that was important.

City seemed to be doing well. Put my kids in a good high school. What did you what what was your career when you got back? Uh I went to for a few years I went to work for Bayer Diagnostics. Bear in in Germany it's called buyer but bearer and I worked for three four years kind of in a a logistics job again that I'd been doing some of that in the Marine Corps. Uh, and so that was okay.

But it didn't seem uh I just spent 23 years in the Marines and I had been part of something bigger than myself and I liked that feeling. And when I was working there, I probably didn't have that feeling. And frankly, I was I was really good at the beginning that I thought, nah, there's got to be something more here. And I frankly didn't probably perform as well as I should have in the last year or two. And I just moved on from there. And then all of a sudden, I'm running for mayor.

Yeah. I want to know this like where was the first serious conversation where either someone approached you or you said to someone you know I think I'm going to run for mayor. I was asked by two gentlemen to look at running for mayor. No one anybody would know but one guy was partially engaged in politics. The other one wasn't. He said you got the skill set to be the mayor.

You need to look at this. Nobody's running on the Republican side. You you really need to look at this. Uh and I did. I I looked at it. It didn't I I had thought maybe I should run for Congress or something before, but I didn't know the landscape.

Nobody You have to understand it. Nobody knew who I was. I'm not in any political party. I'm not I'm not talking to anybody. I know nobody. I don't even know how the power who the power players in Indianapolis are.

I don't know anything. I just have two guys asking me to look at this. And that and that was it. That was literally it. And then so I called up the county chairman and [clears throat] on a Friday I have no idea of the schedules at all. I you just you can't believe how much I did not know.

And I called him up. I said, "You don't know me. I'm answering machine. You don't know me. I'm Greg Ballard. I got two guys telling me I should run for mayor.

What should I do?" That's the message. I love to find that that [laughter] old voicemail. It's like, "Hey, I know who it is. The guy who I told that to is actually on TV every week." Oh yeah, you get calls like, [laughter] "Hey, I just want to know what what does it take?"

So what did it take? You go from an answering machine, you leave that. What has to happen and the dominoes have to fall in place for you to end up unseeding a a a sitting mayor with a $5 million budget. It's the ultimate and comic sausage. You just can't believe that how you this came together. He called me back a week later.

I was at the golf show at the uh u where was it? It must have been at the fairgrounds that year. I'm not sure. She called me back a week later said slating is tomorrow. Now, most people don't know what slating is, and there is no slating anymore, but slating is where the party regulars got together and decided who they wanted to win the primary a few uh few uh months out. That's all it was.

So, it's kind of a gathering of the regulars. It's not like uh there's not like a primary to see who there was a there was a primary, but the slating is three or four months before the primary where the party regulars get decided we want to bless this man or this woman. We want this person to win the primary essentially is what it was. And then they tell everybody this is who we really want. That's where all the endorsements start to fall so and so. Okay.

But slating doesn't occur anymore. It was only in Indianapolis and Lake County at that time. It doesn't occur at all anymore, which is probably the right thing. But so they they uh I did not get slated there because they do not slate the mayor. Again, this is comic sausage making at its finest. It just is.

And you probably have people coming up asking like, "Who's this guy? Who's the new guy?" That's exactly right. I went to the slating. I put seven I made a one pager over seven made 700 copies of one page. I put it on the chairs the morning before everybody got there.

Then I stayed there the whole day. Started to introduce myself to a few people here and there. I had one guy. Now, you got to understand, I'm I spent 23 years in the core. I'm 50 years old, 53 years old, I think. And a guy comes up to me and teaches me how to shake a hand.

Really? Really? This is So, some of this was weird. Most people were nice to me. The political operatives maybe not so much because this was their turf. I'm I'm Who am I?

They don't know who I Nobody knows who I am there, right? Nobody. So, but it I stayed there and u as it turned out uh the guy that the party wanted to win the primary made some illconceived statements that got public. Then, uh all of a sudden, I'm the guy. I'm the guy. There were three or four other people, but they weren't going to be the guy.

I I was I was now the guy. I could walk and chew gum, and I they didn't think I'd embarrass anybody. And that's why I got the nomination because I knew I was put out there to lose by 30 to 40 points. I knew that from the beginning. So that if you knew you were going to lose, like what were you telling yourself internally to your family? Cuz no one wants to go out into an election and get smoked.

Like that's a little embarrassing, you know, like why were you what were you telling yourself internally to say, "Yeah, I'm going to keep doing this." Uh actually, I didn't tell myself that. I uh I figured here's what I told myself. I'm never going to be in this position again. I'm going to give it everything I got. That's what I told myself.

That's the right answer. That's what I told and literally that is what I told myself all the time. But it was odd. It was an odd. We went down to our kids were at IU at the time and we went down to tell them at the Colorado steakhouse. I said, "I'm going to run for mayor of Indianapolis."

Both my kids broke out laughing at their dad. Both of my kids broke out laughing. No way. You're like sitting them down. We're going to have a serious talk. Like just so you all know, I'm like running and they're like, "Dad, like what are you talking about?"

So that's where I was. That's where I was But I I understood that. And so how long is the time frame from when you like how long do you have to go out there and shake hands and campaign? Well, we started that after they had a special slating session for the mayor. So again, go [laughter] going back how people put all this together. Since they did not slate the mayor at that early February meeting, they had another one because they have to slate the mayor by law.

They had to slate the mayor at that time. Not anymore. So they did that and I won that easily. Yeah. Uh but because it was people told them to make me win easily, if you will. And then we go into the primary and but before the primary, I'm out trying to raise money, trying to do whatever, but nobody's given me a dime because all the people who have money and all political operatives on both sides of the aisle know that I'm being sent out to lose by 30 to 40 points.

So me getting on the phone trying to raise money is of no consequence because most people don't answer the phone. And even if they did, they're kind of they're not they're not laughing at me, but they're kind of saying, "Yeah, thanks, but no thanks." And so that was of no consequence whatsoever. And so we didn't raise any money really to speak of. Uh and so we figured out a strategy that we just go to neighborhood groups and we'll go to business groups and we'll just sit on in these meetings. I didn't speak.

I just I just listened cuz yeah mo most of the meetings I went to originally didn't know who I was cuz no one knew who the Republican candidate for mayor was cuz he's a non- entity. So, I mean, I'm just sitting in these meetings like they're probably trying to like get you to buy a membership to whatever thing is like, "Oh, we got a neighbor in town." A little bit like that. But I So, but I went to I did that all over the city and went to different groups. And what was the big sentiment like what were the big points that you were hearing from these neighborhood business groups? This was uh before the recent property tax fiasco, there was a property tax fiasco that year in 2007 and people were really angry.

Not really the mayor's fault, but people across the board were just angry. 40% of the mayors lost their races that year uh because of property tax private tax and other things. Now what happened also in Indianapolis at that time the again the the incumbent who's a really good guy Bart Peterson wonderful guy wonderful guy but they raised taxes they raised the income taxes also heading into the election 3 months before the election 65%. They raised it 65%. So the property tax go that all of a sudden I'm in the game. I didn't have any money to pull.

You're like, you know, look at that. It feels like we're doing pretty okay. Just exactly. So I that's exactly what was happening. And uh there was a feeling going on kind of like there is now frankly there was a feeling going on about uh oh god who that people are whispering in my ear. were saying certain things in my ear, particularly Democrats who are saying, "I've never voted for a Republican in my life and I'm going to vote for you."

And over hundred of people did that to me. Why? Why do you think what were you saying that was getting people a bipartisan amount of people to vote or to to give you some positive sentiment? I wasn't saying anything. Nobody was listening to me. [laughter] People were angry, but I knew they were angry.

And uh but what I eventually started saying is what I heard in all those neighborhood groups and I was just sitting there listening and I just said but there was a collective thought if you will and that's what I said when it came time to actually do campaigning and getting out there and doing debates and I was just putting it in different words but you know we have to look at property taxes we have to look at income taxes what what are we doing here public safety was always a big deal so just I just kind of saying the same thing in different words and eventually caught on and I I actually told my campaign manager cuz we eventually did get about in the last two weeks of the campaign we might have had 200,000 in the bank. A month before I had less than 50,000 in the bank. Now you got to understand what this my opponent has $4 million. He's got $4 million and he's spending it against me going on TV and everything and uh I've got nothing.

I'm not I'm not expecting to get on TV because I don't have any money. But all of a sudden, uh, a poll leaked out and I'm close. And then my opponent went negative on me. Now, anybody in politics knows that if you go negative, it's a close race. It's a close race. He went, no one's paying attention to me.

All of a sudden, he goes negative. Now, all of a sudden, what's this about? Like that means it starts to be like, oh, you're worried. Yes. Like we're worried. That's what that is.

That's what And then all of a sudden money started coming in. That's the piece that I I think I despise about politics is that it becomes a spot where like you have to play the game. you have to like you know you get a statement and the statement is downplaying somebody else who has like largely done a good job right like uh let's say the city mayor mayor Peterson like if the memory serves me right it's like doing the work for uh Lucas Oil Stadium like the capital improvement board and a lot of like I mean things that have I think now we sit 20 whatever years later have probably been positive for the city and I would say there's a large positive sentiment but then people have to start going at each other and so and so is bad at this and so O sucks at this and blah blah blah and I just like he did do a lot of good things and we kept a lot of things that he did but I I never really ran after him either and uh people were angry by itself and as I as I said many times there's power in just letting things play out and we kind of let it play out.

I mean, when the on the budget meeting where they were announcing that income tax increase, I actually got into the meeting, but they because they closed, this is unbelievable, not the mayor, the city county council president closed the door to the city county building, which is it's never closed, but he closed it that day. It was 95 degrees. People are wanting to get into that meeting. They couldn't get in that meeting. They were shut out of the building and it's 95 degrees out. That became its own story.

And again, press is coming my way now. They're making mistakes right and left. And and I just I told my campaign manager, "Don't let me don't let me make the big mistake on TV." And really, I mean, I I just had to let this play out. And in the debates, uh, he was gracious enough to give me four debates. All I had to show in the debates that I was capable of the job.

I didn't have to win the debate or anything like that. I just had to show I was capable of the job. And I did that. And now all of a sudden something's really up. So, and as it played out, I I actually told a gentleman 4 days before the election, most people still think I'm losing by 30 points. I told a gentleman before the election, uh, he was the former deputy mayor to Steve Goldsmith.

I said, "You're going to be the first phone call I make after this election." And he said, "I'd be proud to take that call." And he was the first call I made after the election. and we met two days later. Wow. Okay.

I got to know election night. Like what does that look like? You're It's like down to the wire. Where are you sitting? Where are you Where are you stationed at? So this is at the Morat Theater downtown.

And again, there no one's expecting me to win. The press is not expecting me to win. My own party is not expecting me to win. None of this is supposed to be there. Uh, in fact, I would tell you the the county party actually put out literature during that initial slating convention saying the goal was to win the council in 2007 and win the mayor's race in 2011. This is 2007.

So, like people are probably walking up like, "Hey, great job." Like, you did good. You did real good. So, it's kind of funny. So, we have we have a room rented. I didn't rent it because I'm not I'm nobody still.

I'm I mean, it's election night, but I'm still nobody. And they gave me a room to sit in and I I didn't sit in the room. I'm I was a Marine for God's sake. I'm not going to go sit in a room by myself while everybody else in the Come on. I'm not going to do that. So, I went out and and just hung out in the Yeah.

in the big room. And that night, I want to know like what are you thinking about? Like you just went through this campaign. A lot of you have a shot sometimes, but you don't have a real shot. Like what's going through your mind? I I actually I thought I again I thought I was going to win by the last two weeks.

I really thought I was going to win. You got to believe it. You don't believe it. Nobody's going to win. I've got I've got no polls to back that up. the other party had they know they had polls and that they knew they were in trouble but I didn't I didn't know that as a fact but I certainly felt it and Doris Anne Sadler the the former county clerk wonderful lady uh came in in the afternoon to follow the results on her own valition just to follow the results uh to try to help me out and help the party out to make sure all the votes came in the right way and stuff like that.

So, she was there and then she she came that night and at 6:00. Uh, now you have there's like 40 people there at 6:00 when the polls closed and the TV comes on. I'm leading the race. I'm leading the race and all of a sudden more people started coming downtown. [laughter] So, everybody thought I was going to listen now started to come down to that event. I knew you I knew you [laughter] could do it.

I believe in you. There were several hundred people that came down after that and it got kind of rowdy down there and the press started to come my way uh in bigger numbers and uh and I I held it all the way through and I you probably don't know the name. You might not know Robert Bane, a wonderful guy, still works with he's working with me right now and and uh I still very good friends with him. He was on one of the TV stations and uh doing the commentary on the election and I was leading and then he pointed out to the panel that the only precincts that are not in are from the south and south is Republican territory and he said on the air Ballard's going to win this thing and that's when he said the panel just dropped their jaw said oh my god he's going to win this thing so it was it was a massive upset I had national interviews after this after this thing and I didn't know how to handle them frankly.

Yeah. I mean, it's like I feel like largely remembered as one of the greatest like political upsets. True. Who's your story? Uh it was it was it was wild, Nate. I mean, it really was.

But as I say, it's America. People get a vote, right? Yeah. And uh Bart called me. He's very gracious guy as he is to this day. And he said, you know, congratulations.

You did did a great job. Let me know how I can help you. So that was that was good. Now, but I don't know anything. I don't know anything about anything. So, I I didn't know I was supposed to wait for his concessance speech before I went out and talked myself.

I didn't know that. People criticized me for it. Hell, I didn't know that. I didn't have I didn't have any speech written up anyway. I had to I wrote it on the fly as I as I was walking in there and and it was Look, the PR team's in the back like, "Dang, we didn't plan for this one, right?" What?

Just kidding. You knew you were going to win. But I also knew at that point in time, and I I'm not an arrogant guy. I'm pretty I'm not arrogant at I'm pretty humble guy, but I also knew that my status had changed at that moment. Yeah. I mean, I was old enough to know that my status changed.

I wasn't arrogant about it, but I also knew that uh this is now going to start going my way a little bit. Yeah. And so you you win, you're the mayor of Indiana of Indianapolis. Like, you know, I mean I don't know. You don't know what like you're literally like I didn't even know I was supposed to wait for the concession speech to go out there. Like what do you do day one, you know?

Like, all right, you wake up, you're the mayor, let's mayor. You're like, I guess you have a little bit of time. You know, you take over officially at the beginning of January. Uh I Well, not enough time, but yes. So, the next day, so I I get home I leave about 1:30. I probably get home about 2:00.

Again, we were just talking about phones off the air, right? Uh ever since this moment, my phone has never been on. Uh I got TV stations coming to my house at 6:00 in the morning. All four at the time, four TV stations. They're all coming back to back to back to back back. I get to home about 2:00 and about 4:00 one of my high school friends who I haven't seen in forever calls me three times between 4:00 and 4:30 and I didn't answer any time but he keeps calling.

So I'm he's presumably drunk and he's calling me. So I didn't get any sleep that night and I got four interviews to do in about two hours. Thanks buddy. So I so I find out that uh you don't sleep that night, you sleep the next night. But I so I got through that day went and got a haircut. I I went out and met some people and did things like that.

So, but the second day, uh, we did meet Joel Joel Loftess, the guy that I set, former deputy mayor at Goldsmith, great guy, and my campaign manager, John Cochran, were in my in, uh, in the office. Uh, we had a little office in the county headquarters, just a little thing in there. And John, who's a wonderful guy, just a terrific guy, is sitting in front of me. And, you know, people are nervous, the legs go up and down, and they bump up and down. And so, his legs bumping up and down. Uh, and I he says, "God, what are we going to do now?"

And I said, "Well, John, we just won the race. Surely we can figure out how to do a transition team." Of course, this was clearly the case of we didn't know what we didn't know. But Joe Loftess and uh the way he does business all the time, very dry sense of humor, very polished, very professional, hilarious, too. Unbelievable. John and I talked for about five minutes.

He's got a briefcase and he just says, "If I may." and he opens the briefcase and he's got the entire transition plan ready to go. The entire transition plan ready to go two days after the election. Two Saturdays later, we're in a conference room at a law firm downtown. You're you're not going to believe this. 200 people are there to help me out on the transition plan.

Lawyers, CEOs, missed you guys during the campaign. doctors, former directors in municipal administrations, people who worked at the state all came out to say, "We want to help you with the transition." Yeah. Oh my god, that is unbelievably humbling. Yeah. Uh and and they gave me a transition plan for the ages.

They did. It's the model. It was the model transition plan. And unl pulls it out. They gathered all these people together. uh they they put together the first team, if you will, for me to to help me out, the people that I had to select, if you will, to for the administration.

Uh everybody that they sent to me, I I chose all of them. One one guy seemed to not fit and one lady didn't want the job. Uh other than that, every everybody fit perfectly and we had a tremendous team to say the least. And they had a tremendous team all eight years. If you look at what they're doing right now, you'll see that. But the uh and it it just when it I mean, I'm still a rookie.

I still don't know what the hell I'm doing, you know, for the first six, eight months, but I had a such a great team around me all the time that it worked out and it worked out great for the eight years. Yeah. I mean, it's a story. And in that in those eight years, I want to know when you look back, what are some of the the crown jewels, the biggest moments, the things you're the most proud of the city of Indianapolis from 2008 uh through the end of your eight years later? We inherited the Great Recession, so can't can't do anything about that. And that was the worst economic downturn since the depression.

So we inherited that and that stayed. I remember Dave Reynolds my first comproller. He was a great a great guy. So don't worry mayor about three or four years the the uh in the tax returns will start showing up and we'll have more money. That never really happened. [laughter] But uh we had a lot of decisions made during that time frame frankly and and we had to make some gutsy calls.

One of the first things I did though even before we got into that in one of the big projects which I'll tell you about here in a second but uh I called Jim Ersce up in January of 2008 never met him never met didn't know him didn't know him at all called him up and I said that's the crazy part to me suddenly like you know you win the election and like your contacts just start to like the yeah called Jim like of [laughter] of course the mayor would have the owner of the colt's phone number so uh I called him up and I said you guys put in a good Super Bowl bid last year Uh my sense is the iron is hot. I think we should do it again. Then I called Mark Miles up uh who at the time was the head of the central Indiana community uh partnership partnership uh who now runs the track. He's a he's a CEO of Pittsky Entertainment and all all that involved. Uh I said, "Would you chair this? If we do this, would you chair this?"

He said, "Yes." And there knew next thing you know I'm uh few weeks later I'm down at the Super Bowl in Phoenix [laughter] trying to figure out what all this is going to look like because you're bidding this is right when you're bidding you're bidding for 12. We're bidding for 12. Well, yes we were bidding for 12. Yes. And uh so Urs wanted to take us all down there to get get a feel for it and and he did and so so thank thankfully for that and then we got the bid.

So that was uh we made some decisions kind of early on. There was a lot of stuff I think we need to some low hanging fruit. I think stuff that we did that we had to do. But Miles and the team put together a bid that was even though the previous bid was really good. They did a really good job. Yeah.

The year before, but this eight bid was off the charts. We just released an episode with Fred Glass. Yeah. Uh on the 20 We talked a lot about the 2011 bid and just like getting down there going to five ballots against the Dallas Cowboys and the stadium is bigger, they get more money, like all these things. But like the it did seem as though the sentiment was the typical Indiana fashion like hey don't give up like go back out there put together a heck of a bid and and you end up that's that's a big win early on to get some solid momentum. It is, but nobody expected that cuz I'm the new mayor and they didn't think I was going to do anything like that that they I think they were probably going to wait another year or something before.

But I I I really in the first couple weeks I'm in office. I I I made that call cuz I knew it was a good bid before uh again I don't know I still don't know anybody at this point in time. You have to understand most people voted for me probably didn't even know who I was. I mean that's that's where we were. So, but I just thought we we should run it back and they did put in a really good bid and Jerry Jones just threw it all and and but boy, karma is real. In 2011, there was a huge ice storm that moved from Texas all the way up through Indiana and that would have affected our Super Bowl if he had gotten it then, even though we would have known how to handle it.

I was in Dallas. Trust me, they did not know how to handle that at all. And it was bad. It was a bad logistical setup. No question. And then karma karma comes full circle and it's like 60 degrees in February and beautiful in the city of Indianapolis.

So I I've been to the previous four Super Bowls and there's there's writers row and there's radio row and things like so the writer rows there all right they're silent as can be. The radio row is like a party going on and it's the same uh radio DJs uh every year and I went to all from Hawaii to New York. I went to interview talk with these guys. They always want to talk to the mayor of the next city or whatever. So I did this for four years with guy named Chris G who works at Visit Indie. Great guy.

Yeah. He was uh he would hey you want to talk to the mayor and and they all said yes. And I said don't worry about Indianapolis. It's going to be warm. Trust me. I'm saying this in 9 10 11 and 12.

Don't worry Indian. It'll be warm in Indianapolis during Super Bowl week. Trust me. Trust me. And then it was. And then it was.

Kind of just willed that into existence. It's Monday after the Super Bowl is in the 30s. Yeah. every other day but in the 60s. That's crazy. [laughter] Okay, I want to talk a little bit about the Super Bowl and then hit on maybe one or two big highlights from your time as mayor.

When hosting something like the Super Bowl, being the mayor of the host city, it just seems like there's I mean there's four years plus of planning, putting it all together, and trying to give it the the pizzazz to make it memorable. I think the the worst thing could be you don't want to just host another. Okay, it was just a Super Bowl. Like Indianapolis gets one shot at this. You want to put your best foot forward. What all had to happen to create I mean such a memorable experience for um all NFL fans.

I think most people who follow these things would probably tell you the Indianapolis Super Bowl was still the best one ever. We were the first one to put the village together. No one ever did that before. Uh if you had been the previous Super Bowl we've been to, you had to go 45 minutes over here or 50 minutes over here and it was not connected up. There was no sense that something was going on. No matter what city it was, whether it was Phoenix or Dallas, there was no sense that there was something happening in Indianapolis.

There was a sense that something was happening. And the village was the concept of uh Allison Molton uh wonderful lady, previous guest of the show. Spectacular episode. I had her and Doug on. It's awesome. She's unbelievable because she, you know, she won several Emmys.

uh doing the gymnastic for NBC who knew about a village uh and and uh the Olympic village. So we brought that concept to Indianapolis and it was a wild success for 10 days bands going from noon on. Do we remember the moment when someone said yeah what about a zipline? I don't know who did that actually. So, here's what I find. You know, I've written about this obviously and I always joke that my job was to stay out of the way until asked to join and that's kind of what I did.

But we just like typical who's your fashion. We we were open to ideas. What What can we do here? So, the zipline was a big deal. We had the first social media center ever. Yes.

They were talking about that. Like that was pretty cool. Yeah. So, we did lots of stuff. And the JW. Yeah.

Well, JW was a big part of this. And when I again when I became the mayor during the transition, they briefed me. They said, "We need if if we want to do certain things, we need this hotel." And I said, "Okay, I I get it. I understand it." So, it wasn't built yet.

It wasn't even It was conceived, but it wasn't no shovel in the ground. I had to prove it. And I did. And the JW I'm talking about the Lombardi Trophy up on the side of the JW as well, right? Like the world's biggest billboard. Hancock Graphics, man.

Yeah. They they now do that all over sort of thing all over the country. I think that was the first time that was ever done like that. Yeah. Now we do it on lots of things and uh but I think they're doing it around the country now. Frank Hancock, great guy.

Yes. So now it's uh it's Sport Graphics that I did a whole interview with them about how that like really catapulted them into the brackets and signage all across the country. It's really really neat, isn't it? Yeah. I mean so cool. I do think that was the thing about um about Indiana Indianapolis was like dream big and then figure out how to execute it right from wasn't there a thing with scarves from people all around the world Special Olympics uh in Idaho I believe they did that scarf and somebody in the team knew they had done that they brought it to Allison and Allison thought it was a killer idea Mark did not Mark did not he didn't think it was a killer idea and he said but he said Allison you want to do it go ahead and do it oh my god Did that take off?

Did that take off? People from around the world were making and sending scarves, right? Not just grandmas. All over the world, people were doing prisoners were making scarves. Uh people, like I say, other countries were making scarves. One lady made 250 scarves, and they all had they they didn't look alike, but they were all blue and white with the with the Super Bowl tag on it.

I just had Scott Dorsy on it. He talks about one of his pinnacles. again, he's growing this like billion-dollar enterprise, but he really wanted to talk about being the marketing like chair of the Super Bowl committee. Like that was what he was fired up about. And he talked about doing that and doing a standard quality customer service training for all of the hospitality workers in the city. And we did.

Yeah. [laughter] Yeah. In Indianapolis is different. And I I know this sounds like cheerleading, but Indianapolis really is different. We needed 8,000 volunteers, 13,000 showed up for 13,000 signed up. We got 8,000 and and our volunteers unlike Dallas and other places.

Our volunteers actually show up. Yeah. And they do the work. Well, that's like been the secret sauce of the sports court, right? An army of volunteers. It is.

It it is remarkable. Plus, there were I can't remember the number of people in that were in the Super Bowl committee. Not very many. Uh we had like 30 committees. Only eight were run by full-time people. The rest were all volunteers.

And volunteers in Indianapolis range from from that grandma who wants to help or the guy who wants to rake the sand pit in, you know, in a track meet or something, uh, to the CEOs of companies, major companies. Again, like this was the time Exact Target is like ripping. They're like, I either had just gone public or going public like and he's like, oh yeah, this is the perfect time to go be the the marketing chair of the Super Bowl committee. It's I I've seen hospital CEOs just in different places. Yeah. Uh supporting a parade, helping people get to the front of the hospital CEOs are out there doing that.

That's who Indianapolis is. That's why the Super Bowl works so well. It's is it's amazing sauce that happens. And there are so many success stories. Breast cancer research office being one of them. Um and especially with minority women.

My wife is Asian and so she donated. It was just a remarkable story. uh some of the a little heartbreaking too. It's wonderful, wonderful stuff. Really is. When you look back at the Super Bowl and Indianapolis, like what did crushing the Super Bowl in the city of Indianapolis, what did that mean for us as a city and us as a state?

I was told ahead of time, don't expect any economic development afterwards. I said, it looks good, it feels good, but don't expect anything afterwards because that's not the pattern. That's not what happened in in Indianapolis. Leonard Hoops told me that,00 more conventions were now looking at Indianapolis as a result of the Super Bowl. They did uh I think a company was I want to say is it Vocus or Voke? I can't remember.

Somebody uh followed all the PR and how much did we get PR we got out of this? You're not going to believe this. 99. 7 of the articles were positive. 3 were neutral. There were no bad articles about the Indianapolis Super Bowl.

Holy cow. That's pretty impressive. That's pretty impressive. The media loved being here. I mean, I I think there's like an iconic shot of the JW with the uh with the Lombardi trophy on the front page of the New York Times. Yeah.

Like this is the kind of press that you could not pay for. It was It was worth millions upon millions of dollars and it did affect conventions. Uh no question. That's so interesting, too, cuz again, you could read different articles and stuff now looking back and it's like, well, we lost money on the Super Bowl, but we gained money. Like, it it's all interesting to me. Like, I just think in terms of getting people to talk about a place, like what's the economic development of the Indiana Hooers winning a national championship?

Like, you can't even put a price tag on the marketing and exposure for a city for a state like that. Talk about hosting the Final Four, hosting college football playoff. like there are second and third orders of magnitude and like you know publicity and all these things where people start thinking about vacations and conferences and all that that it's like I would say very challenging to put tangible dollars and cents to that but it it matters and there's a feeling some of it can be tangible like the conventions but when Butler went to backto-back uh championship games the president at the time Bobby Fong told me that they got three to four times as many students applying to Butler as a result I mean right now it was crazy I I would I'm sure that this past year the IU admissions council has had their hands full. Like people from all across the country, all across the world are like they keep hearing about Bloomington being such a beautiful special place and it's like you got people from all across the world that want to come and and get their education here and their academics are excellent beyond belief.

I mean, it's really really good and and I did not with my career there, I did not maximize any of that and it's it's probably my biggest regret to this day. But it the the schools are topnotch and and so they I'm sure they not only got more people coming in, but I'm so sure they got more Yeah. donations, too. I I want to talk about like one other piece that was pretty big and it's kind of uh relevant to my journey. You're going to find this interesting. Just trust me, listeners, and listen to the end of it.

But a piece of it was with the EPA and the Indianapolis public water utility. Uh this is interesting to me. I just canoeed from Muny to Indianapolis 84 miles down the White River. Like there's this hugely negative uh stereotype of the White River that it's gross and it's dirty and that the mistakes of a company back in 1999 are still present here today. And as someone who just spent 5 days out there, like there is a lot of life and growth and natural resource development that's happening. Take me through what led uh Citizens Energy to kind of take over the public utility here in Indianapolis.

So when I inherited a federal mandate from my predecessor, again, good guy. Had to had to do it. EPA and the Department of Justice, they were always there for gravitas to intimidate you, frankly. Uh and they said spend 1. 8 8 billion 2% of median household income. So I I want to dive.

So you get a mandate from the EPA that says you as a city need to spend 2% of median household income to update the infrastructure. Update the sewer infrastructure. Yeah. Because it was overflowing 25 30 times a year which is why the White River was dirty and they wanted to get that down to two days a year so it would be clean. So yeah, we pushed back on that because I had a former water company owner named David Sherman. Yeah.

Who became my first public works director, came out of the retirement to do this. Again, I had unbelie I had unbelievable people. Uh he re-engineered it to $1 billion, bigger, faster, cheaper, greener. The EPA said, "We don't care. Spend this amount of money." And we said, "No."

700 cities are going through this at the time. Yeah. Seven. Because I was in prominent in the US Conference of Mayors, 700 cities and the EPA was doing this to all of them. Saying that there's just like a broad thing. You have to spend 2% of the house in.

But not knowing that each place might have different cheaper to build different infrastructure like different levels there. Okay. That's they're all different. Yeah. But it didn't matter to them. And and I they'll deny it to this day, but it's actually was true.

And uh so after what I call dancing for a year uh we were ready to go to court on it. Uh the regional office in Chicago said no no no spin. And finally the national office realized they were going to be embarrassed by this. And just before we were going to go into court they they relented and said Indianapolis you're right. Now understand there's 700 cities going through this. and Inappa stood up and said, "No, we'll fix the problem, but we're going to fix it this way, not the way you're telling us to do it."

Yeah. And it was much cheaper. So, we saved at least 800 million, but probably a billion dollars for rateayers, not taxpayers, rateayers at that time while this was going on. Uh, and that's what Dig Indie was. So, 20 m of tunnels, one big deeprock tunnel, 7 milesi long, which really helped helps all the time now storage and movement. So, it's a big deal.

Big deal. And uh at that time, we're looking to put the water and waste water into citizens. Uh which is kind of funny cuz citizens always wanted it and no mayor would ever give it to them. Uh I'm trying to give it I want to give it to them. Why? We we took because I wanted to take the politics out of water and wastewater.

All across the country, mayors, govern whoever is using water and wastewater to buy and sell buy and sell so they can get some sort of cash for their pet projects. happens all over the country routinely. I wanted to take politics out of wastewater and water forever in Indianapolis. Uh, you know, my my team said, "Well, we got to say it'll be cheaper and this and this and this." And it was significantly so, but I said, "That's not the main issue. The main issue is to take politics out of this."

And that's what we did. What was the sentiment of Indianapolis after you did this? Uh, it worked. They did see that their bills eventually went down a little bit. It still increased because we still had that federal mandate. I mean, we had a certain point.

So, it did go up a little bit, but it didn't go up nearly what it was going to go up. So, first you have to go fight a 1. 8 1. 9 billion EPA mandated capital improvement project for sewer, right? You you know see that there's a a cheaper way to do the same amount, right? You get it knocked down billion dollar project, but at the end you still have a billion dollar project that has to It still has to get done.

That's right. And so we kind of combined that. There were actually two separate transactions, but it worked out best. And so Citizens actually took it over while we were still doing Dig Indie. So then then they took that over. So it all I think it all worked out because Citizens has a an excellent reputation.

Yeah. They've been around for now over a hundred years. And and they're interesting because people are like, "Oh, it's a private company." They're a public trust. I believe it's a public trust. Not really a private company.

trust, which has like a whole community aspect with profits and things like that. Um, I don't know all the ins and outs of that, but I know that it's different than like if I were just the owner of a utility company. They're not allowed to make a profit on their utility part of it. They they have other things that they make a profit on, but the public what's called a public charitable trust. Yeah. So, the utility rate, they're rent like a business, but they don't make a profit on on that part of the business.

They do in other parts, but you got Jeff Harrison there, wonderful guy. Carrie Lyens was there before. It's really wellrun. Has been for a long time. Yeah. I just think that's that's interesting now because this is what 2011 somewhere around there.

Right. Right. The project just finished now for it was a 14 year. [laughter] It's a big project. You know, I mean, I feel like that's something that's interesting, too, because a lot of people in public office are like, that's not like a there's like a a threeletter acronym for like not this term. like it's if it's not going to be something that I'm going to reap the benefits of, it's like screw it.

That's somebody else's problem. We never thought like that. Which I appreciate because Dig Indie now finished in 2025, came fully online and has been doing work obviously right now. One, I think it's important that people know that it was never a flood like flood prevention system. That's not what Dig India is. It is a separating your CSO, your combined sewage overflow.

And so getting making sure that you know the things that happen to make the White River dirty sometimes and you know have sewage joining in with the river separating those out. So you'll see that the White River will flourish hopefully. That's that's the intent and you'll see it'll be much cleaner in the future and if you get big rainfalls like we just had it'll be better. It'd be much better. So it's it's u it may not look like that this time but uh actually it already had some impact over the course of decades you're going to see I believe it'll be huge for huge it's 100 years 100 years plus project. Yeah I mean for sure the uh the final piece I want to wrap out with today is your latest adventure.

That's what I'm going to call it. Okay. This is an adventure. So I'm about my fourth life right now. Yeah. I mean from from six 6 and 1/2 years senior to Marine veteran to mayor.

Now you have thrown your name into the ring for secretary of state. And for anyone knows so you ran for mayor on the Republican ticket, right? Up uh upsetting a Democrat. It's in a Democratic city. In a Democratic city. Yes.

And won which is already impressive. Now you're back and you're running as an independent for the Indiana Secretary of State. Lot to unpack there, but I want to start is how did you end up in this independent situation? So, I've been asked to run for lots of offices before, you know, Senate, US House, Governor, mayor again all the time. I get asked to do that all the time again, but none of that felt right. This felt right because of the potential of us.

We have it's a series of circumstances that have come together this year. Independ a group called independent Indiana has been looking at this. Why the heat? Why the toxicity? Why why is everybody screaming at each other? Why do we hate politicians?

All of that. This is Nathan, right? Nathan. So great dude. We think a lot of this is there are no competitive general elections. The primary is the main election now for everybody.

And so you're allowed to scream at each other within the parties at that point in time, but you don't have to come to the middle for the general election like you used to because of gerrymandering. So for instance, 95% of the legislature was des decided by 10% of the voters in May. In May there those elections are not competitive in November. Yeah. So, back when I was growing up, you could be on the you could be on the far right or far left in the primary, but then you had to come to the middle to the g uh for the general election, and now you don't. So, that tells you who gets in office these days because of jerrymandering.

So, you win the primary, you're in. That's a real problem. Uh so, that's that was the genesis of all of this. Yeah. uh they needed somebody who probably has some some name ID to look at this. Uh we have a problematic incumbent.

We have then Secretary of State's race is the only race you could do this in where you can make a difference and in ballot access and more voter choice. You can't do it in the governor's race and everything else by law. It's the Secretary of State's race. 2% you can form a party. 10% you can be in the primary. It's this race that determines all of this.

I think this is an important thing to to learn. So, in the Secretary of State's race, it takes 2% to have your party formed because And why do you have to form the party? That's a really good question and I get that all the time. You saw what I had to do. 37,000 signatures, hundreds of thousands of dollars. All of that went on.

If I wanted to run again, I'd have to go do that again as an independent. If you form the party, you don't. So we provided a vehicle not just for myself for this time and the next time but for other independents throughout the state who have to go get signatures also. So that's what this is because that's expensive and not everybody can do that. That's right. And it's very hard and it's purposeful.

It's purposeful. They're trying to keep independents out. The Republicans and the Democrats don't want anybody in this thing. only right now only one in five registered voters can run for office as a Republican or Democrat and if you're an independent you got to go get these wild signature requirements and do all this and you're just so far behind at that point that's all purposeful. They don't want to give up their power and they they made the law so they don't have to give up their power. We're kind of we're breaking through that.

Yeah. But it's interesting because I mean you do come with a history of the Republican party. Yes. Yes. So, like what was what was like the thing that got you to say like I think there's a different way because there there's no voter choice. It's very we need more voter choice.

We need more voter choice. And I'm everybody knows they saw it as a mayor. I got a very public record. I was a rational, practical, problem solving kind of guy and that this is what this plays into. This is who we want to run for office. This is who the people want to run for office these days.

And are you getting that sort of person from either the Republicans or the Democrats? Right now I'm suggesting no. And so 41% of people in Indiana see themselves as independents, 40 46% nationally. What? Yes. The split in the country is not Republicans and Democrats.

Their split in the country is 50% see themselves as part of the Republicans and Democrats and 50% see themselves as independents. That's the split in the country. I think that's really interesting and I can see the validity in that people saying like I just don't do polit like I just don't do politics like you know I'm not I would not claim either party. I'm just kind of like an American over here doing my thing. And that's really interesting. That's where it is.

Yeah. And because of Jerry Mandering in most states, not all states, but in most states that the primary winner has no competition in November. So they could stay out on the wings of the party, if you will. Mhm. And so there's a there's a path here and we had to get through the path, but it's again very punitive, much more so than other states. Uh but the irony of this is somebody coming from this angle to run like this is usually inexperienced.

I'm actually the most experienced by far in this race. I've got a reputation. It's very public. Uh, and uh, so for good or bad, however you see it, I would suggest to you that uh, you know, 8 months ago I was the golden boy of the Republican party. Now I'm the devil. Right.

But I mean, that's just the way it is. But I'm not I haven't changed. I haven't changed at all. Has you have you noticed that? Oh, sure. Like have you Oh, sure.

No way. Oh, sure. It's obvious. It's it's it's so it's so obvious. Well, and what convinced you like you probably could have, I don't know, put your name in the hat through the Republican party and been on the ballot that way. I'm an American first.

Spent all that time in the court. You got you got to get this about me. This is my team sometimes hates me to say this, but this is not about me. Listen, I'm I'm I'll be the best secretary of state. I don't think there's any question about that. I've got by far the most experience.

I want the job. I want this I want this thing. But 20, 30 years down the road, you're going to need more voter choice. You want more voter choice because you don't have it right now. You don't. We are a very, very closed state for voting in America.

Very closed compared to other states. You need more voter choice. You need to know who to vote for because you don't. I bet your audience doesn't know there's two constitutional amendments on the ballot this fall. You don't know that. because you don't have a voters's guide.

You will now. What is this? That's a That's a voter's guide that's going to be coming out very soon. Wow. The in a voters's guide down to the precinct level individualized for you. You could do that now with technology.

Wow. This is crazy. No one's ever done that. No, you're right. People say what they're going to do. We already did it.

Yeah. That's it. Down to the precinct level. Six ways to cast your ballot. Voting absentee by mail. Early in-person voting.

Where to vote early. Wow. And down to the Wow. Candidates are in there. The pictures of the candidates are in there. What what their office does.

No. Is in there. No one's ever done that. Some states do that, but they don't do it like that. They don't do it like that. Let Let me show your audience.

I got another one right here. Yeah. Yeah. This is it right here, man. Right here. And you're calling down to the precinct level.

You're calling it the Lincoln party. We We have to take a name. Obviously, it can be the Independent Party. Judges, I mean, courts won't allow that because it's a generic term. So, we chose the Lincoln party, but it be it'll be a party for independence. Did you sit around like was there like a table in a meeting and people like start tossing?

I would love I'm a big name guy. I want to like name something at some point in my life. I can just like imagine being in there around the circle and someone's like, "What about Lincoln?" I suppose somebody did that, but I didn't. When they said Lincoln party, I said, "That sounds great." There you go.

[laughter] So, I was on board. But that isn't that amazing. Yeah. That I mean, never seen anything like that. Have you? And I feel like I'm I'm curious to like read it.

Uh because it's going to be online, right? They'll have an app. Yeah. It'll be We're going to push it out to every registered voter either physically Yeah. or you'll have an app. Yeah.

And it's it technology allows it to happen. But again, they don't want you to know this. The parties don't want you to know this. They want to hold on to the power. And if you actually tell them what's who's voting, who's actually on the ballot and I think they they're not going to like this sort of thing. Yeah.

Because they don't if they wanted they could have done this a long time ago. We think this is going to cost a penny for every $100 the state spends. It's not very expensive. Yeah. I bet they've they I think that's just a thing in general is being informed. Like I think about going in and I don't know.

I feel like a lot of it it's like I don't even know. I don't know really know what's going on here. You're trying to like become you know you're looking at the signs as you're going in like you know doing your due diligence and your research and you know I don't know. I feel like it's a a challenging thing to be completely informed about all things and all parties. This is super. So, so, uh, you'll have a sample of your ballot in this thing.

You can mark it up before you go in. Can you take things like this in with you? Yes, you can. I feel like that would be a good one. Yeah. So, so that will move along.

Plus, you'll already have the research right in your hands. And yeah, isn't that remarkable? That is remarkable. So, that that's the sort of thing I'd like to do as a secretary of state. We need to make the office independent. I'm not going to endorse anybody.

I'm not going to donate to anybody. I'm not going to fund raise for anybody. I I'm out of politics once you're in that office. Absolutely out of it. And and I will do that. And no other party's going to do that either.

But that's you saw recently in the last month the recount commission where they're making political choices on who won an election. Holy cow. A large I hate to say this, a large faction of the Republican party wanted to subpoena voters to ask them why they voted the way they did. That just happened two weeks ago. Yeah. This is not good.

This is not good. It h it all has to change. And unless we get independence in that office and people who will work with everybody to to bring about this change, it's never going to happen. And that's why I'm running. That's this office has to change. And I'm the guy to do that.

That's that's why I'm doing it. I'm not doing this for me. I'm doing this because in 20 30 years from now, this thing has to be different than it is today. Yeah. Wow. I mean, I could do a full truthfully like a full threeh hour, five hour EP.

I could just sit in here and chat with you all day long. This is great. And I could do it, too. Trust me, I could do it. I've got stories. I I'm sure.

And well, and I just love I love Indianapolis. I love Indiana. Like I don't know. I think that it is a place where politics has a lot of people divided. Again, like I'll post I've had every candidate now. So, I'll say like I've had every candidate on the show, talked to them all and like I'm a human being.

Like, you know, I'm just talking and telling stories with all of them. Like everyone I think that too often people look at names or posters or signs and just stop forgetting that there's people behind those eyes like in every in every How did you like both? I had a great conversation. He's a good guy. He's a Marine like that. Again, I just enjoyed all of it, you know?

And so, and I had a good time with Max. So, I'm sitting here and I'm going to put this out and in my comments I'm going to get absolutely roasted. [laughter] Like, then I'll put out another one and I'll get absolutely roasted. And it's like, yeah, it's it is what it is, you know? I think that at least for me, being able to sit in here and meet people and hear stories and talk to them because at the end of the day, there is like, you know, the policies, but behind the policies are the people and people who listeners deserve to get to know and meet and make their own decisions. So, I think that's right.

Um, this has been so fun. I think in a non-election cycle, I'd love to come on and just talk about random Indiana things. That would be super fun. I would enjoy that. I would be more than willing to do that. Uh, I'm like all in.

My like latest So, I get obsessed about things in regards to Indiana. My The first one was I memorized every county and county seat. I memorized every high school and high school mascot. People People love that. I'm about 80% now, but when I was studying, I was I was nails 99. 999%.

And uh my latest is just the history like starting from like the territory era from Vincent's to Coridan to Indian like I'm just so fascinated. I want to be like a foremost expert on the history of Indiana. So this is like my next my winter project is becoming like a de facto historian. There's some good history there. there. It's really interesting.

And my favorite one, I've said this on a few, so people don't don't go don't go anywhere, but uh my favorite part is that collaboration is built into the fabric of Indianapolis. When you think about the rail, there's no question about that. No question. You talk about one today, they see the Pacers, the Fever, everyone, the Kohl's, everyone working together, different organizations coming together to do things, but it goes back over a hundred years. The first ever Union Station in America was right here where you had different private entities that all had their separate railroad stations and you know you had to cart across the city to the next one. The first ever union station right here in Indianapolis.

Lots of stories there. Citizens is one of them. How was that started? Eli Liy for the benefit of the community. And I I will tell you just as being the mayor, we there's I don't think there's any this is not cheerleading. I don't think there's anybody in the country where the civic sector, the private sector, and the nonprofit sector, philanthropic sector work together like Indianapolis.

There's nobody does it. It's hard to imagine Indianapolis and the state of Indiana without the Little Endowment. They've done things people have no idea. Unbelievable stuff. But the business sector is always there. The civic sector, we all work together, which is not what other cities do.

My favorite thing to do to people and like ask them when I'm uh out and about is like where is the the largest publicly traded company east of the Mississippi and they're like New York City or they're like Miami, Florida. And I'm like Eli Lillian company in Indianapolis, Indiana. That's the number one. And it it blows people's minds. That's recently though. Yeah, as you know that's recently but but they've they've done really really well.

John Necklider set the table wonderfully. He was a chemist by trade. I don't know if you know that. He was a chemist by trade. Uh, wonderful guy. Set it up.

And then David Ricks is just knocking it out of the park. Listening to him speak. He's so far ahead. Oh my god. He's so far ahead of everybody else. This is why you lead Lily and I make videos for the internet.

That's why for sure. He's unbelievable. Um, this is this has been so just great. I've really enjoyed this conversation. The part that I think is interesting, [clears throat] one obviously you as a competitor, you as going out there to win, but there is other other milestones along the way of what 2% and your the Lincoln party is created. Is that what you'd say there?

Yes. And at 10% you're in the primary. That's right. Just in this election. So, if 10% of voters or whoever votes, if you get 10% like this party will now be on the primary, which is I'm planning on winning though, just so you I know [laughter] I'm just there are there are other milestones along the way that will that can also open opportunities for the future for other candidates as well, which I think is cool. I like competition.

I think that like competition breeds excellence, right? Which is pretty cliche. I dove chocolate right now. But it does, but it really does. And we don't have competitive general elections in November. And we should in every race.

Yeah. And I think that that's how I lean and like think about it is if I win, I want to I don't want to think about sports. It's like you don't want to beat the worst team in the league. You want to beat the best team in the league and you want to, you know, do all that. So you've got to be if you're going to be the champ, you got to beat the previous team. Yeah.

You know, you come at the champ, you best not miss. This has been so fun. I'm rounding it out. I have four questions left for you that I ask every guest who comes on the show. So, first one is brought to you by our friends at JC Hart. They're a leader in creating enjoyable living experiences at apartment communities all across Indiana and beyond.

Check them out at home isjart. com. So, here's my question. From Indianapolis down to Bloomington, into the Marine Corps, around the world, you choose to come back to Indiana. Why do you call Indiana home? Uh, it's where I grew up.

That's I've lived here almost all of my life. It's where I'm most comfortable. My family and friends are here. Uh, I just I it's just what it is. I mean, I'm I'm Hooser through and through and always have been. The final three questions that I ask every guest who comes on the show.

So, the first one, this is your opportunity to shed some light on a part of the state that more people need to be talking about. What is a hidden gem in Indiana? The rolling hills of southern Indiana. True. It's beautiful down there. Yeah.

when I I rode in the little five and uh back in the day we rode those hills in Morgan Monroe State Park and people forget on single speeds not on 10 speeds at the time we were almost 50 miles every day uh on those hills on single speed bikes boy we were in shape but the rolling hills of southern Indiana are absolutely beautiful and I wish more people would go down there and look at them yeah and I would even say like you know the 65 corridor you know the 69 corridor but like take some back roads and end up somewhere in the middle. Yeah, [laughter] there's some crazy cool stuff down there. Absolutely. All right, next. This is how we get new guest recommendations and learn about other hooers that are out there inspiring people. Who's a Hooser we need to keep on our radar?

Someone who's doing big things. Let me give you more than one if I could. I'll be quick. Absolutely. Two mayors. Brandon Sacklean of Terode, Democrat.

Chris Jensen of Noblesville, Republican. Pretty young guys, really good guys, very smart guys, somebody to keep an eye on. And I would tell you a third one that um more lots of people maybe not know, but Laura Gel, who is a neighborhood leader here in the city of Indianapolis. Wonderful young lady, wonderful young lady, Laura Gifl. And I think uh I hope she I hope she gets ambitious and uh starts trying to make more of an impact, but she is a special special lady. Really is.

I've had both uh Mayor Jensen and Mayor Sack Bun on the podcast. Both incredible. Uh very very uh I don't know just like fun, easy to talk to. Good people for sure. And like Zack Bun, he's young. Yeah.

Like I think he got what did he get voted in at like 28 or 29? Like something crazy like that. Nuts. All right, final question. Obviously, being a Hooser is is special to you. Uh, you know, being a a leader within Indiana, a leader within Indianapolis, now you're going back for more.

I just think that's commendable. And states need public servants. So, I want to know when you think about what it means to be a Hooser and you close your eyes, you think about it, what is your favorite Indiana memory? June 22nd, 2001. I'm [laughter] sorry. [clears throat] I'm flying home from Germany.

Yeah. Coming home. I'm retired from the Marine Corps. June 22nd, 2001 was that flight to come home to Indianapolis so my kids could call Indianapolis their hometown. That was it. That's special.

Sir, it has been a pleasure to hang out. It has been a pleasure to get to know more about your story from here in Indianapolis down to Bloomington, around the world, and back again. I I could sit here and tell stories and hear your stories all day long. If people want to learn more, if they want to get plugged in, if they want to support, how can they do that? Uh, gregbellard. com.

It's all on there. There you go. So, I appreciate if people get in there and see what we're all about. [music] Thank you so much for coming on and we'll talk to you soon. Thanks, Nate. This episode was brought to you by Accounted For Indiana [music] CPAs who built the firm they wish they had existed when they were growing their own businesses.

Forget hourly billing and slow responses. Accounted for wraps tax, bookkeeping, consulting, and virtual CFO services into one simple monthly fee. All cloud-based, all under one roof. You get a real CPA who knows your goals [music] and actually picks up the phone. Check them out at accounted4cpa. com and tell them that the GetIn team sent you.

Thanks for listening to today's