Yeah, Alex Cooper was wearing gold hinge on Call Her Daddy episode with Winnie Harlo and it's like I think you get a little bit desensitized to some of these things. This athletic prowess that's happening in Indiana for females. It's amazing. Yeah. Like isn't that sick? Before I got things to turn around, I took pictures of everything in my house like a lamp, anything cuz I was going to sell it on Facebook Marketplace cuz I needed the money.
I mean, obviously entrepreneurship can never take your eye off the ball, but do you feel like you can breathe a little bit? From South Bend to Evansville and everywhere in between, this is Get In, the show focused on the Who's Your State and the incredible stories happening here today. I'm Nate Spangle, founder of Get Indiana, and I will be your host for today's conversation. Quick pause in the action. If you're headed downtown for a Colts game, you've got to make a stop at St. Elmo Steakhouse or Harry and Izzy's before kickoff.
Both restaurants open early on Colts home game Sundays, and you have special pregame menus that you can grab some food, a drink, and get yourself ready for the game. At St. Mo, you've got the classics, their famous shrimp cocktail, filetmenan and wagu sliders, prime rib chili steaks, and obviously you can't go wrong with a bloody mary. Over at Harry and Izzy's, they're leaning into the breakfast side of game day. They've got breakfast fillet sliders, eggs, and avocado, orange scones, plus plenty of cocktails to get the day started. Harry and Izzy's opens at 10:00 a.
m. and St. Elma opens at 10:30, so you've got plenty of time to grab a bite before heading to Lucas Oil. Honestly, that's the way I do cold Sunday. Good food, a couple of drinks, and then head to the game. Visit saintmo.
com or harry andizzies. com to check out the pregame menus and make your reservation. Now, let's get into the show. My guest today is Katherine Watercutter. Now, Katherine was one of the best distance runners in the country during her time at Indiana University. She's a seventime all-American, a multi-time Big 10 champion, and she got third in the nation in the 5K.
After graduation, she got a job in sales, and at age 23 started a women's apparel brand called Goldhinge as a side hustle to make some extra cash. Fast forward to today and Goldhinch now clears more than $1 million a month in revenue. And in 2024, Katherine is named to the Forbes 30 under 30 list for retail and e-commerce. I am so excited to dive into this incredible journey that it's it seems from the outside looking in. You know, it's entrepreneurship is all up and to the right, fun, sunshine, rainbows. But we're going to dive into the whole story that led you from Louisville, Kentucky to Bloomington, Indiana.
And today up here in central Indiana. I'm so excited to welcome you to the show. Yeah, thanks for having me. Yeehaw. Oh my gosh. Well, one thing about me, I am a like a low and slow runner.
Like I love running. It's very, very fun. Uh but being fast has never really been my forte. So to have someone that has uh the accolades and prestige that you do in the sport of running, I'm really really excited. This conversation could go anywhere from again your time at Bloomington that now is a football powerhouse, your time running, which uh I mean from some of the most iconic venues in the country when it comes to that and building an incredible e-commerce company. Uh I want to start, you grew up in Kentucky.
What was your perception of the state of Indiana and Indiana University as a kid growing up in Kentucky? Well, um, if you go to IU, you know, there are a bunch of people that are in Bloomington saying they're from Louisville, but they're from the border of Indiana. So, um, I grew up in my dad's side of the family was from southern Indiana and Floyd's Knobs area. And so, um, I actually lived there until I was five and he worked right across the bridge. And if you know that area, people pop back and forth like it's just across town. So that's one of my that's one of my biggest pet peeves.
Like you'll meet someone from New Albany or Jeffersonville or like Floyd County and they're like I'm from Louisville and I'm like big difference because we didn't get instate tuition, but they get instate at UL. So it was very you kind of just blur that border. But um my family was all from Indiana, so I was I felt a little bit of a hybrid. And my dad was always a big IU fan, a huge Bob Knight fan. And growing up, he always told me that you need to look at IU. You need to go to IU.
And um I, you know, in high school looked at all the I wanted to go south. I looked at all the SEC schools and ACC schools and whatnot. And wasn't until the very end I made it there. So, I was really familiar with it. Where was the moment in your high school running career or maybe middle school where you realized that you were in a rare breed of runner that you were like an elite division one going to have a future in the sport of running? Where where did you realize that at?
Um, sophomore year I really had a breakout year. I actually got recruited off my sophomore year times, which in running it's, you know, every sport's different. In running it's kind of later. they look at junior senior year, but I had gotten a stress reaction um my last year and got mono and had a few bad things happened. So, uh I'd say, you know, to be completely honest with you, um sophomore year, I thought, okay, maybe I can be decent. But you compare the Kentucky Times with Indiana times at state, you know, we'd always compete against Caramel and they would kick our ass at meets and so that was very humbling.
So I never thought that I was going to go to college and achieve what I did. I actually remember watching the national championships in Louisville cuz I ran in Louisville. They hosted one year even in college and I remember watching them finish the 6K and I was just I don't think I want to run in college. It really wasn't until maybe junior year that I even considered running in college. Um to be honest looking back there's so much that I love about running but I hated competing. Um it caused me a lot of anxiety and stress and I think that I am very much an achiever and knew I was good at it.
Do you think that was external stress, external pressure or internal? Like you put uh a large amount of anxiety on yourself? Both. I mean, I think that I want to just achieve something. So, I went through it. So, I played lacrosse in middle school and even freshman year at Assumption.
And I had never run track before until high school. And my coach, you know, something that I really enjoyed was field hockey and lacrosse. And I was decent at them. that um you know when I got to high school he was like if you really want to be good oh by the way if you want to go on this New York City trip uh you can't play lacrosse and I was like okay well when I got to high school everyone on um the high school team had never really played before so I mean as kindly as I can say it they weren't very good and I was like okay well I guess I kind of need to go the path of like where I could maybe be actually good and um so you know I realized I won state my sophomore year in the whole state and yeah in the 800 but Kentucky is slower than Indiana. What kind of time were we talking as a sophomore in high school? You win state.
I want I ran a 455 mile. It was not that great. I mean in college I went on to run a 435. So, wait, that's nuts to me that in however many years, like 5 years or 6 years of training, whatever, between sophomore and college, it's like you're you're fighting to cut down 20 seconds. When you're like at the pinnacle, it's like I'm trying to cut down like 20 minutes off my marathon time. Like, I'm trying to cut down from like 4 or 330 something to like low threes.
And it's like we're fighting for 20 seconds on a mile. Well, to be honest, I think my coach did a tremendous job in high school because he kept it so light. I mean, I remember we had a very talented group. So, everyone I graduated with and you know, we go on to win state, they went all to D1 schools, but we would go on our runs and be like, "Oh, let's let's stop and look at these frogs. Let's run around." I think that we did have some talent and we were lucky, but we still had a lot left in the tank.
And you see runners go on to college and get burnt out or maybe they never run as fast as their high school times because they're training so hard at a young age. And I really applaud my high school coach for that that um he he made it fun but he gave us workouts that you know we were going to get better but not overdoing it and we all went on to improve in college. So wow. So, when it comes down to making a decision, what was what was the final straw that said IU was the right place for you? Looked at all these big schools, I almost went to Alabama, did unofficial visits um to I mean, an unofficial visit to SEC country. Has to be a great time.
Well, I did an official visit to Alabama and almost went there, but I ended up going to Miami of Ohio for a semester. I think I got a little bit, to be completely honest with you, freaked out by how intense some of the D1 schools were. And so I was talking to a lot of bigger schools. Um, you know, I'd had set up a official visit at Oklahoma State and freaked out about that. Like it they it seemed very intense. And what I liked about Miami, Ohio is I thought that I could okay, I can run but still kind of like have an identity outside of running.
But then when I got there, I was like, "This is not my place." And I ended up um transferring. I didn't want to go reconnect with other places cuz there was a reason I didn't go there. Like I was this close to going to Alabama. Um and my mom went to Alabama. So, you know, it's funny.
It was between IU and Alabama. But um I realized like why did I if I'm going to run, I want to do it at the best school that I can run at. I'd rather be a small fish in a big pond than a big fish in a small pond. I've always been like that. And so, you know, my dad had always pushed IU and I was like, "No, no, no." And so then at that point, I had to walk on at IU because all the scholarships had been given out.
So, even girls that there was a girl from Kentucky or like people that had slower times than me had the scholarship because it was locked in. And at that point, it's already given up. So, I had to walk on at IU. And when I got there after a semester, because, you know, I wasn't on the team anymore, I can't get out of shape to continue on a full year at Miami or else, you know, you lose fitness. So, I was able to transfer in January. And at that point, my I was so out of shape.
I ran from I ran a minute slower in the mile than I ran in high school. It was embarrassing. It was a horrible moment. I I was just so I had low iron. I My shins were dying. I got to Bloomington.
There were so many hills. I was like, I don't know if I can do this. I don't know if I'm ever going to be in as good a shape. Like, it was just one thing after another. You know, I And you're a walk-on now. Yes.
Right. So, I lost all those scholarship opportunities. And I mean, there was a point where um you know, my assistant coach, he's the coach of the women's team now. He was joking. And he was like, "You know, I never thought that I didn't actually, you know, I told you over and over, you know, you can get there. You can get there."
But he was like, "Yeah, deep down, I didn't really know if you could, but I just kept telling you you could." And um my mom had went to the UL meet. I wasn't traveling. Of course, I was horrible. And he she met my coach, the head coach at the time, Coach Helmer, and you know, he just made he's very dry, old school, intimidating. He made a comment to her.
He was like, "Yep, she's going to have to go home and train harder than she ever has before." And I did. And when I came back that next summer into my red shirt freshman sophomore year, they were like blown away. And that year I made the um travel team cuz only eight can travel in track and field. And that spring I scored in Big 10's. And then I went home and did it again.
And that next year I got 11th in the country in cross country. And that was my first all-American status. So when I want something, I am pretty determined. Let's go. It was that's like a monumental moment cuz it you kind of come back, you're a minute slower. It could be like which is huge.
And again, like I was running a time had no business even being at the college level. And again, we're you're trying to cut down. You talk about running a 453 getting down into the 430s, like 20 seconds to go a minute the opposite direction. Like that's big gaps that we're trying to cover there. And it could have been a defining moment, too, of like, well, maybe I should see what life looks like outside of running. Like maybe I should, you know, go all in on the sorority or go all in on, you know, the social life in Bloomington, which there are there's no shortage of opportunities there, right?
But to lock back in, at what point did you get on the scholar on scholarship? So after I scored at Big 10 that spring, my coach gave me 25%. So you know, in football it's full ride, nothing, whatever. In track, they, you know, especially with title N really get not much, but they'll split it up into percentages. So some people can have like 10%, 15%, 20%, 100%, whatever. Um, not many, at least from my knowledge, not many runners, at least on the IU team, are offered like full rides because they're so limited.
They have to split up the same scholarships across track and field and cross country. So, you're talking limited number of scholarships, not as many as football gets, across an entire like 60 women, you know, group. So, um, I got 25% and then that next fall I went and I was I was the only one who qualified for nationals. So, I'm traveling with two guys who made it and me and our two coaches cuz our team didn't qualify. So, you can qualify as a team and then they take a couple individuals. Yeah.
And it was in Teroot which is funny because of all places. Paradise, baby. People all over the country. It's a central place. Was this track or cross country? Cross country.
2016 like a nationally recognized cross country course and so does Louisville which is funny because they'll have they pulled nationals too. So um after that race when I got 11th and there's a couple hundred people in the race it's Oregon everyone I Stanford um he gave me full ride. Let's go. Which is awesome. You talk about literally going in there you have to earn everything you're about to get. It's like you're a walk-on.
You got a minute to shave off your time. You get 11th in the country and then I mean you really stacked up a ton of accolades after that. You're talking about multi-time all-American, multi-time Big 10 champion, what Big 10 athlete of the year. Yeah, I got 11th place in nationals and first him first team all Big 10. Um and then I took Yeah. 11th at nationals and then that indoor season I qualified indoor at Texas A&M in the 3K and um got all American and got sixth in that and then second team all-American we had we qualified the DMR and I held the school record in the 3K 5K and DMR but I do think the 3K was broken maybe.
Um that's insane. Okay, so a couple questions here. One, when you're like cooking, you know, you're trying to win a race, you're breaking school records, what's the internal talk track like in the hardest, you know, the final K, you're in the 3K, so the final I would say I mean, you are having a mental battle with yourself truly. Like I will never forget the final last 2K at nationals or even the year I won the 5K in the Big 10 which is still my personal record of uh 1528 and we were on the track and I mean there's like a video of it um and it's funny cuz Laura Overton was um announcing for the Big 10 that year and it was me and this Penn State girl. I mean, I was like a couple inches in front of her and it w you're just I remember at the beginning of that race even like hanging on like hang on just one more lap, one more lap cuz you just want to fall back but you gain energy by sitting behind somebody in the track.
And so then like on on cross country, you know, you're hanging on and you just start picking off people. And there were a couple races that, you know, before I knew I was going to get 11th in the country that one the my freshman or my red shirt sophomore year, I just every race I finished, I like just started balling because it's so emotional. And I got second, the first big race that I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is huge." was second behind um a runner from Michigan, Aaron Finn, who was nationally ranked. And I you just start crying because you you know when you're in the middle of the race, there's a bunch of people around you. You don't think that you're going to finish that high and you just hang on for dear life.
Like you're having the biggest mental talk. And I think that's what I hated about running is competing because you have to go out there and give it your all over and over and before you start the race you like know it's going to be painful and you just like hang on for dear life and you're having this conversation with your head like oh like I mean I think any runner at any level gets that. It's like in the the like I feel like um in the marathon everyone knows like mile 20 that's where you start to have like this internal battle where you're just like keep going like this is where the race really starts. It's the last 6. 2 And you have to trust yourself. That's the hardest part because there are times where like I would fall back and the the race I got third in, I was in the back the first several laps and then you have to just start trusting yourself like, "Okay, I feel good.
Move up. Move up. Start picking people off." And then you just hang on for dear life. And then you get to the like I just try to turn off my brain in the middle of it. And then when you get to the end, everyone is like the coaches and stuff are screaming at you and you're trying to stay relaxed and yeah.
When it comes to your running career, is there a specific moment that you look back on and say that you are the most proud of? or honestly it's probably the three races I'm talking about is um they all have a common theme of just hanging on and it was the 11th place cross country the second at big 10 that year and the um third in the country and it's funny cuz I went on to run win cross country big 10s the next year home home course at IU but I think I'm more proud of the race that I had I got second in because it was just how I went out there. Like I was supposed to win that other race, you know? I wasn't expected to do what I did. No one expected me even in really the top seven. And so I think and and same with those other races like stats and everything were predicting me like maybe in the top 40, not 11th.
And so I'm not I don't find myself big on or responding to the prove everyone wrong. I think cuz I've had teammates be like, "Oh, coach said that I wasn't going to make the demar. I'm going to show him." It wasn't I always had a different mental mindset of like I want to prove myself that I can or I hear that feedback. You know, when I was leaving Miami of Ohio, I had a coach that said, she had said something to the team of the effect of like, you know, she wasn't committed to being great and stuff. And then she went on to Florida State and I ran into her at other races and she was just like, "Hey, good job."
And I was like, "Thanks." Um, I I think that it's more of I don't I take that and I internalize it of like, "Don't listen to it. It's not anger towards people that underestimate me. It's more of like prove yourself. Yeah. Right.
Prove that you can, you know, and so I'm really proud of those three aces. I don't think there's one over the other, but Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like exceeding expectations, you know, where it's like you come in with an internal standard of like, you know, this is kind of where where maybe you or you know, the data, the media, whatever says, and then going out there and just putting an effort out. And I do think whether it's youth sports, whether it's running, whe at the end of it, it's like this was everything.
Like that was everything I had to give to whatever the sport was. That really reminds me of my last Big 10 cross country race. I was running on a stress reaction. I It was funny because I like was in place to get all American that last year. I mean, I was crossraining. I was not in shape and that kind of started that burnout.
But, um, you know, they were putting needles in my glute and everything right before the race and popping so much ibuprofen and everything. And I had won the previous year. So, this was my senior year and I was having a full-blown anxiety attack. And my dad, I vividly remember him pulling me into the bathroom at my parents house and him being like, "What is the worst that could happen?" And I'm like, you know, I've got tears in my eyes and everything. I'm like, "Well, I'm going to go out there and get such and such place."
And he's like, "If you go into that race and you give it everything that you have, whe matter place you get, do you feel like you could walk away and feel proud of yourself and that you can live with it?" And I was like, "Well, yeah." And like that really helped me because of course you have all these eyes on you and you feel expectation after you achieve something where everyone's like, "Oh, well then she's going to go on and do, you know, just like IU football probably feels right now." And um yeah, you know, you just have to give it everything you have. And if you're proud of that, then you can live with it. But what you can't live with, at least what I would really struggle with is knowing that I, you know, gave up mid race.
like the uh okay, the last two seasons for IU football, they're playing with house money. You have almost no expectation. No one's like no one thinks you're real and then all of a sudden you prove that you're real. You win a national title last year. Now all of a sudden you're going in there and they're like, "We have expectations for IU football." And it's like they start a little bit uh they start a little bit slow in the in the opener.
They're like kind of getting it all figured out. People are like, "Oh, like is IU football?" actually turns out they're still really good at football, but like there's there's pressure and expectations versus when you get to play or compete from like a freedom perspective where you're like no one thinks anything anyway. Like let's just go out there and let it rip, baby. I had some deep conversations with my coach cuz he had coached I mean people have gone to the Olympics. Um he passed away a little over a year ago and he was such a great mentor to me, Coach Homer.
And um he had pulled me in, you know, after I had achieved some stuff and was like, "You've got to be careful with the expectations." You know, he he showed a bar, and I've told my employees this, too. It's like, you don't want your expectations to start, you know, um crossing over and going above reality because over time, the better you get, the harder it's going to get to be even better. And um yeah, it's it's it's a mental challenge because you think, oh, if I just do everything that I was doing before, I will get better. But it's it's not the case. You got to do even more.
And so, you kind of have to keep that in check. And yeah, that's where I feel like uh a lot of people get to with running. When you first start running, let's say as an adult, not like a not not a per a high caliber runner that's like, you know, winning and competing nationally, you just start running, you're like, I'm going to run a marathon. And it's like every month you're dropping like five or 10 minutes from like your times and you're just cruising. It's going to plateau. And then at some point you're like you run a really good race and you realize oh to qualify for Boston I still have 30 minutes to shave off this and you're just like all right there.
Basically you have to like keep your expectations in check. It's hard. Wow. So going from I mean a super stressful athletic career, you know, putting yourself in these races, intense moments, you then choose to pursue a career in another extremely stressful side of both sales and entrepreneurship, which is like you talk about going from one stressful scenario to then when you start to you start any business, it is stressful. There's a lot of expectations. There's a lot I mean then you start to hire employees and grow like there's a ton of stress there.
Why was entrepreneurship the right route for you to go? You graduate from school, you get a job in sales, you come to Indie, and then you start in this entrepreneurial journey? I joke all the time. I'm like, I didn't sign up for what I'm doing now. Like, I had no idea. Um, people always ask me how I went this route.
I'm like, when I was starting Gold Hinge, I didn't even think about it being entrepreneurship because I've always been a natural entrepreneur. And like I know everyone did the lemonade stands and everything, but I was like full-blown had so many hustles growing up. And you know, Gabby's probably heard this a billion times off camera, but um it's you know, I I came across my card business uh recently. My mom saved a bunch of the cards. I would take card stock of different colors and I would take um you know the scrapbooking things or I would glue a penny on the front of the card and it would be a good luck card. So I made these greeting cards and I literally went door to door and that was like one of many businesses.
I had jewelry business. I had all these things I would go door to door you know three for $5 all this. What was the first side hustle you had that made a dollar not from your family? It was probably that or my jewelry business. Wow. Before the age of 10.
That's when you can get someone you don't know to pay for something. I think that is like the true mark of a young entrepreneur. I mean, I guess I probably got some money indirectly or directly from my parents from doing chores, but I will say my parents did a great job not giving us everything when I was younger and really shaped who I was. You know, my dad was a business owner. I watched my oldest brother go start um a marketing business and exit that. And so, you know, my dad always, you know, my mom would joke growing up, "You're going to need to marry yourself a rich man."
And my dad would be like, "She is going to be the rich man." Oh, hell yeah. Oh, hell yeah, Pops. Let's go. You know, I kind of always was like, you know, my dad, you know, made comments growing up or put thoughts in my head of like, you can do whatever you want. And I didn't really know what I wanted to do growing up.
I just knew that I, you know, I was interested in fashion and interior design and that's what I studied at IU. And I knew that I just wanted to do something of my own. I want to achieve. I want the power to struggle but have the opportunity. And so when I started Goldhinge really, it was just like I've always been like, what can I do to like make some money? Or more so, it's not just all about money.
It's about like putting energy into something to watch it grow. And so, yeah. Wow. Okay. So, let's start. You're 23, I believe, when you start Gold Hinge.
And you're working a full-time job and you kind of start this as a side hustle. I was still doing athletics and I was driving. It was a rough semester, too much on my plate. So, my last year at IU, cuz I was doing a fifth year, I had a class that you couldn't take over the summer. So, I had eligibility left. I wasn't in many classes.
I was only in about I don't know 15 20 hours. And, you know, without my coaches knowing, oops, if they end up hearing this, I was driving to Caramel twice a week to work an internship at a commercial design firm for 4 hours. I would get up at 6:00 a. m. , do my shakeout run, get in the car, and drive, which would be an hour and a half with ice or weather. which is terrible for your legs.
Drive to um Caramel, do the internship, drive back in time to make it to practice, then you know go to class, then do weights, training, everything. And I decided that or that spring of 2019, cuz that was my fifth year graduating year was to also Oh, well, I want to find something to do. Oh my gosh, I should start an online store. This would be great to add on the the beginning of like not even the beginning but Shopify site like doing the whole e-commerce thing. I was I did all I mean yeah I'll I'll get into that a little bit because I don't think people even some people who work for me don't realize all the how e-commerce driven I was and all the data and everything. But I think that truly what was driving that that last semester of like putting so much on my plate was like I knew that the passion for running like I was so burnt out at that point emotionally too and mentally that I was just trying to find things that would like fill my cup and that would be my future.
Yeah. So you start this uh spring semester of your senior year. Yes. Didn't do much with it. Like I started out buying wholesale doing like more of like a boutique um business uh model and you know I get into the summer and I'm doing all these e-commerce courses and all this stuff but not like branded stuff like other brands. I was buying other brands and it wasn't really strong cuz I'm very impulsive.
I am like you better start not perfect. I really like looking back I didn't do things right but I figured it out along the way and I remember um that summer not doing much with it and I'm getting into my sales job I'm really struggling you know there was competitors have been working that I'm supposed to switch that they've been working with the competitor for 20 years I'm 23 I don't know what I'm doing what what industry were you in with sales um countertop and um bath sales so like not sales that happen immediately sales that happen over a course of months and so Um, you know, I was pretty much failing at that. I don't think that was going to last very long. Like I was like, if I don't leave, they're going to let me go, so I need to figure out what I'm doing. And um, I remember my brother at one point saying he had said, well, why don't you redo your business plan? And, you know, my dad and brother have always been like kind of business mentors, even though they don't really know anything with this.
And um so I went back to the drawing board, decided, okay, I'm not really doing anything with Gold Hinge. Like it kind of was just like a site that barely anyone was placing orders. Like maybe got a couple orders a week, something like not doing much. But that's still like that's not nothing. I wasn't investing much time per week. Like I was preoccupied to even get people to order anything offline is is already like you have momentum.
You have a little bit, right? Because there's so many people that start a business, they launch their website thinking that the orders are just going to roll in and they they never make up whatever. Yeah. So many people get caught up trying to make a million dollars online that they forget to make a $100 online. Exactly. So, you had some momentum there.
So, I don't really count all of that in 2019, but that fall I decided to redo my business plan, go all in on that and you know, like I got new inventory, I redid my site, everything like that. And yeah, still like an online boutique though. Yes. And at the time I had two roommates. I bought the house in Indie. I had saved a lot of money.
You know, I barely paid rent at IU. So you're you're pocket student athletes now get paid. I'm pocking in every dollar cuz my rent was like $300. And I had some money saved up. So I got this house thinking I would have a secure job. I got two roommates.
They were paying for my mortgage that was $1,000 at the time. And I decided to have the inventory in the basement. And you know, come like January, February, I remember my brother looking at the numbers and he just says it. He is he says it, you know, not in the nicest way. Like my dad brother like it looks like you're hemorrhaging cash. And um you know, I'm thankful enough my dad got me a credit line.
Um but like cosigned on it. He co-signed on it, but I paid all of it back. It was my It was very much my understanding it was my debt. um had a credit card and you know I mean I was losing money every month because okay so anyone that studied e-commerce in like the late 2010s everyone compares it to movement watches like do you know what I'm talking like everyone's like yeah you put you put $5 in and $100 every little detail on the website I did all the courses I learned dropshipping I went to I did I went to a seminar on um affiliate marketing to understand ads ads. I was running the ads by myself, everything. And I mean, if you look back at the sales, probably a couple thousand a month, but you get to co time, not to jump ahead, but I decided, you know, tie-dye really blew up before CO.
I have this idea of, you know, my boutique stuff's not selling super well. I'm getting all the preset packs, two small, two medium, two large. I'm like, well, Colin, my brother, I don't know what to tell you. I'm like, I need to buy more inventory. You know, he's like, the problem is not the inventory. You need to figure out how to sell it.
And all b all all business is is problem solving. So, you need to figure out a way. Well, I can't call in. I don't know what to do. Like, I this like I have to tell somehow I can't. He's like, there's got to be a way.
And that's where I start um researching and figuring out how can I control my inventory sizes? I need to go around I need to go around these wholesalers that are selling to me. So, and like for and that's how I started getting into the private labeling. Yeah. So, like for people that might not understand, you were going through these were not branded like you were an online boutique basically like you're buying different it could be from like for like large brands. Let's just say it's like you know you would have one brand A you'd have like this blouse or top from and brand B you'd have these pants from and brand C you have so whenever you go into a boutique physical store even um one that went out around here or Baya got a bunch of different labels um so even you know just how Nordstroms and things are they're they're selling brands but some of these brands that go to market and that these boutiques buy that's all their model is they're only selling to boutiques across the country.
They might not go to DTOC directly online where you can purchase them. So, um, and your brand of like the the name on top of the door like doesn't necessarily matter as much, right? It's just kind of like a marketing thing, you know, like you sell this blouse or this top or this thing or this and another store might have the same one. But the problem was if something did sell, oh, it's out of stock. I can't go buy it again. Or if it's like something like maybe your clientele is a specific size or maybe like runners that had followed you through college like that kind of frame.
It's like great my maybe my smalls or mediums sell but my larges might not. Right. And they predetermine those packs. Yeah. Until you probably get to a certain point like maybe people can get in the door with free people if they have a certain amount of buying power where they can have control over that. But the only access I had I didn't have money to go to market so I was just buying them online.
Yeah. And so, you know, I couldn't afford or at the time, I mean, I had last dollars in my bank account. I would wait for my roommates to pay me so I could pay the mortgage. And, you know, I was not spending money. I could not afford to go out. I turned down anything and everything.
Um, I'll I'll get to this in a little bit, but before I got things to turn around, I took pictures of everything in my house, like a lamp, uh, anything, cuz I was going to sell it on Facebook Marketplace cuz I needed the money. Like I was literally like there were points where I was like I I'm going to be like homeless. I'm good. I mean my parents probably wouldn't let me be homeless. They'd be like move back in with me. If you're into food, this is something you're going to want on your calendar.
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Parking and pizza fest not included with the discount. Go check out the World Food Championships. It's going to be an awesome weekend. Now, let's get back into the show. You don't have a ton to spend. You have a house.
Luckily, you have roommates coming in, but it's like while your friends who might have even like a normal starting salary, so they can go out and buy some, you know, buy some drinks, really eating me up inside because every week I just thought about, man, I could have a paycheck coming in the stability, like I was just a nervous wreck. And I think that's what drove me to make running work at IU because I'm like, well, my parents, you know, took a risk and they're willing to like help me with this tuition. I have to get this scholarship. I have to make this work. I switched schools to to to have this work out. It has to work.
And same thing with um the boutique. I like I couldn't fathom walking away from school having no student debt to digging myself into a couple years of student debt. I'm like I I was just I wanted to set myself up and I'm like, you know, you don't have kids, you're young, now's the time to do it. But I I couldn't. It was yeah it caused me a lot of um uh mental health struggles and um so I kept on going. There were a couple times where um oh co I decided you know before I could really afford to I started talking to some manufacturers are like our moq's 100 units and I'm like I can't pay that.
Like it's uncommon it's a th000 or $2,000 I can't afford that. I have probably $500 in my bank account. Um, yeah, I can't. Um, I was living on some credit card points because I would charge the credit card. I'd get some cash back. And yeah, if I went out, my boyfriend at the time could pay for my food and whatnot.
But, um, I decided that I was going to take white blank champion sweatshirts. And I don't want to get in trouble saying this, but I hacked all the sites. Like I would make a billion different emails to get the 20% off discount code or buy them on like eBay. And I decided cuz tie-dye was blowing up. I went and tie-dyed this one blank Champion sweatshirt. It had the Champion logo so I can sell it because it's it's kind of was like a vintage revival.
Yeah. Tie-dye. Do you know it's branded Champion? But I was paying like $25 for the sweatshirt. I marked it up to 68 and they started flying. like my ad one ad image took off and I was making every sweatshirt.
So from there on like when you say take off like give me an So you're buying these. Say I started with eight or 10 white Champion sweatshirts, you know, maybe I started with like six and I physically tie-dyed them. I have on the site, you know, unique design for each. It takes me about 10 minutes to make the sweatshirt. you know, got to go soak it in vinegar, throw it in the dryer, everything. I go to post it and there's this one image in my mind.
I still have it, um, that I had a girl take of a girl, you know, this girl that was getting into modeling and within minutes, like the ad converts and a couple sales. And I'm like, this in that moment, the scalability, like I was like, oh my gosh, all the thousands of dollars I have wasted trying to learn ads. I mean, I I had every person in the scammy ad world or whatever sell me every course. I mean, I was in thousands of dollars of debt just trying to learn ads at that point. Completely unrelated from Gold Hinge, getting your your funnel, right? It's like you have to create your funnel, landing pages and conversion, all that.
So, at that point, abandoned cart email series. Yeah. So, at that point, I was like, "Oh my gosh." And so, that ad scaled, kept pumping money into it. And during COVID, I was selling, you know, $3,500 a day. I couldn't scale it anymore.
Let's go. But they had to become on pre-order. Everything shut down. I drove to my parents house because I think my roommates were out like why not be where maybe my mom could help me at the time. Free labor. Absolutely.
No one's going anywhere. So, I moved back to my parents house and kind of abandoned the indie house. And I was from 700 a. m. until literally nighttime doing sweatshirts. I had this one designed.
Yes. Well, I made a couple colors, but yes, there were my parents' bathroom. My bathroom was covered in buckets of vinegar tubs. I mean, as as it went on, I just kept getting further and further behind this pre-order. And I kept running into this issue. Well, you know, no one else can do it.
Well, if I teach somebody else how to do it, why wouldn't they just do it? like I they can't do it as well as me and you know and so the fastest I ever got was probably I could do 40 or 50 in a day going all out. I had rashes on my legs. I had carpal tunnel so bad. I had athletes foot. I never had athletes foot but I stand in water all day long and chemicals and soap and my legs were on fire.
And my mom would help package orders. Then I'm trying to jump on customer service and all these customers are like like what? Where's my order? It's like a month. And we was on a pre-order, but the pre-order is just getting bigger and bigger. So, I finally find this guy in LA that can tie-dye, but the tie-dye doesn't look, you know, the same.
And I order some of those. And I think sometime, you know, end of summer, I had to turn off the ads cuz it was not sustainable. Like I remember getting to the end of the summer and the most I had taken off from tie-dying sweatshirts until the beginning of March was half a day because my family was going to a family friend's lakehouse. So at that point it was like this is not sustainable. I can't keep living like this, you know. Now another issue that people sometimes get into is they're pumping that their ad is converting.
You're getting sales, but you the margin isn't quite what it should be, right? When you're buying Champion sweatshirts, you're paying for your time, you're paying for all the the materials. Like, were you Oh, I was I was making money. You're making money. Okay. So, I was I was making money because the ad nowadays I don't think that the things have changed quite a bit.
Um especially as your business scales, but um this is like Yes. So, that is a big thing because when you're first starting out, I mean, I was getting like five, seven, 10 rorowaz and you could get all the data and everything. And then the iOS update came out. For anyone that doesn't know, uh, return on ad spend. So, if you were, if you're talking five, if you're putting $5 in, you're getting $25 in sales. If you're putting $500 in, you're getting $2,500 in sales.
So, it starts to make sense. And it's just like a math equation. you're like pump as much money in on the one side as you can and then and I was charging them for like $70 or something. So when I the ad was converting at such a low cost and I didn't have any employees or anything like I I that was the first month I'd gone from hitting you know um to be honest it was the months prior I think the highest I got was um I don't know a couple thousand dollar to 100k a month and I remember my parents being like I had this whole business plan to prove my brother's Excel doc and everything wrong because he's always looking for the you know what what's going to go wrong and being realistic and as I needed to hear that but I was like you know you can scale ads and you I can hit 100k a month they were like Catherine come on you're not going to scale because they didn't know digital marketing they were like you're not going to scale to 100k a month and then I went and did it and then that's when I had to stop doing the sweatshirts because it truly was not sustainable and they were starting to die off a little bit cuz it was such a big trend and then I went back to like 10k months where I was negative again.
So, I took all this money that I made in that month that was like a 100k and I paid off all my credit line. I and I went and bought new inventory and guess what? Fast forward six months, I was pulling money back off my credit line and I had zero dollars again. Well, that's like the thing, right, where you take it from a a side hustle like I don't want like a a trend like there's ton of really smart people or lucky people that can make 100 grand at the right place at the right time and then it's the crazy entrepreneurs that like, you know, you get 100K of profit, you pay off your debts. It's like, cool, I have, you know, 40 grand, 50 grand left, and you're like, now let's put it all back in. And I was like mentally losing it.
And I had this one guy who's kind of like a mentor helping me. had taken one of his courses of his girlfriends or whatever and he was like, you know, I did I I sold 100k worth of foam fingers and I had to just you I didn't even have them on hand. I hadn't even ordered them yet. You just have to figure it out. So, the people who are willing to do absurd things, and I'm not saying that's something to go and do or to be proud of, but you just make it work come hell or I water. Well, I think a a piece of it too is you don't know what you have to give yourself the opportunity to feel what winning feels like.
You know, like when you're you do 100k a month, you're like, "Oh, wow. This is what winning feels like." When you're, you know, just uh you're just starting out and you have a lemonade stand or you do a popup and you sell a couple thousand dollars, you learn like, "Okay, this is kind of like what winning is, but it's like when we had our first video go viral and you're like getting, you know, you get a thousand followers in a day." It's like, oh, but I'm going to counter you on that because there are several people, have you seen like the movie Pursuit of Happiness? It's like there's some people that they may post for years and never have a viral video and they just keep at it and they keep at it until they finally hit it. And it's like, you know, in those moments I don't, you know, you're doubting yourself.
You don't even know if you're ever going to get there, believe it. I never thought I would, but I am a big into I realize all these years I was manifesting without even realizing I was. Cuz I would go on a run and I would visualize, you know, when I was worst on the IU team, I would visualize myself crossing the big 10 line. No, I would never actually believe tell somebody that's my goal cuz I'm like that's silly. I'm not actually ever going to do that. But I visualize myself succeeding.
And then when it would happen, I am mind blown. But I didn't even realize I would just play it over and over in my head. And so, you know, there were times where I'd never had anything to really prove that it was going to work out. So, until that big hit and then and then, you know, that causes anxiety later on of like, oh, well, you know, I've hit it big and then it doesn't last. and you know the fear I I always you know my mind races about the possible bad outcomes and that's something that I've had to kind of fight with and and I think that's the difference between having a good uh one good run right like tie-dye champion sweatshirts good product right place right time but building a brand like were people buying it because it was Goldhinge or were people buying it because it was a cool sweatshirt design right place right time tie Right. And I never I didn't start through that point of the sweatshirts.
I didn't ever put my face on it cuz I was a little bit embarrassed of maybe the timeline it took to ship the items and everything like that. So, I really hid behind the brand the first couple years cuz I almost felt like, you know, there were points in times where I was like getting blocked on Instagram cuz I was DMing a hundred people being like, "Here's a code to use at the site." Like, I was truly hustling. And so when I'm talking with an employee and they're like, "I can't really figure it out." I'm like, "I yeah, I didn't have anyone to tell me how to figure it out. I sat at my desk all day long by myself in my house trying to figure out how am I going to sell things."
How do you balance that now between knowing what it takes to start a business versus again like you you talk about, well, no one can tie dye quite like me or it looks different. Like when you really want to grow a brand, you do have to rely on other people. And so how do you balance like well hey back in the old days it was just me at my desk trying to figure it out with now like leading and getting people the freedom to try and fail and be creative and bring their own talent. There wasn't a lot like I've learned a lot. Obviously there were things that I thought back then that I was like oh well now the knowledge I know now I would have told myself to do this like that. I'm sure any business owner could say that but I would say it is a superpower.
I remember the founder of Poppy said that, you know, CEOs and founders have this superpower that no one else does. And I believe that there's an intuition. And I think that it gives me it's a superpower, but it also, you know, sorry to my employees. It it makes me a little bit more like you can figure it out, you know, sort of thing because I did, but some people have that or some people it doesn't come as naturally. But I think it forced me to have to be being in that position. I had no other choice.
So it kind of gave me that edge. But now I have to, you know, sometimes put myself in other shoes of like, okay, how would I approach it if I were them without knowing what I do cuz sometimes I forget that I have this, you know, knowledge and whatnot. Where did it go from a good ad and a good product to a full-fledged brand where people start to be fanatics of a brand versus just a one hit kind of wonder on a product? So, I'll say this in the um you know cliffnotee version. I think over the next um year you know I struggled and that fall I you know I was I was about out of cash. I about maxed out my credit line.
So, we go from on top of the world. We got 100K month to like well back in the trenches. We're back. I remember it being in fall and I was going to I I finally got in with this agency and we're still working with them today. And it was my last go. I was like, this is my last opportunity to make it work.
And it was a big investment. Um and you know they said it's going to be a three-month period that you have to stay with us and then to build data and um I remember we're at like month four or something and I was about out of cash and you know I I guess I could have gotten a loan somewhere else with a higher interest rate but I you know luckily I'm thankful for my dad for h allowing me to cosign even though I you know it was my debt and I had said I I need more money and like he was like well you might need to pause your business. I'm not extending the credit line, blah blah blah blah. And I'm like, "Oh my gosh, I'm freaking out." I'm like, "Should I sell my car?" Like, um, and you know, we're still not profiting.
We I I turned to the ad agency and I'm like, "Look, I didn't tell them I was about to go out of business." I go, "Look, I need you to turn around results cuz you said this was going to be 3 months. If I cannot see a positive result and we start scaling these ads, I am going to have to cut ties and go the other way." And at that point I had launched the pleated tennis skirt and I was you know private labeling. I had slowly over those course of months took a stab at you know I was able to buy like just single units and I ironed on my logo on the back of the skirt. This point I'm still hiding behind the brand and whatnot.
I didn't really put my base on it for a long period and then you know they started scaling them. It was a winner the pleated tennis skirt. And you know in my mind that next year I'm thinking the pleated tennis skirt is going to be the sweatshirt. But it continued and it's still one of our top sellers. Got a new manufacturer, improved the design. Slowly over time I you know started coming out a little bit from behind the brand.
Hired two employees. My roommates moved out. Made my boyfriend move in because I couldn't afford the mortgage. Slowly paid off the debt and it continued to scale and I was very conservative. didn't pay myself for the next few years. I mean, I may have written off one or two things or, you know, taken the cash back from credit cards, but I was living very very simply until, you know, I hired my fractional CFO and he was like, you know, you need to start um paying yourself.
Wow. So, it's kind of scaled from there. And um yeah, it's a wild story. I mean, I think that any business is like ups and downs, peaks and valleys. It's like an elevator, you know? You're on top of the world one day and then the next day you get kicked in the teeth and you're like, "Oh gosh."
But the ability to problem solve, figure it out, keep going. And a lot of small business in the first few years is just staying alive. It's like, "Can I keep the lights on? Can I keep going? Can I buy new inventory?" Those are real.
I mean, they're real fears. I remember like I my boyfriend wanted to go to um my husband now wanted to go to Topgolf for his birthday and that was around the month that we started scaling and I I mean I cried. I was like I can't afford Top Golf. I cannot afford the food at Topgolf. I can't afford to go there. And he was like I felt so bad.
And that was around the time I was like right before they started scaling that I was taking pictures of everything in my house. So, I was going to liquidate my house. Because really, everyone has excuses. Some excuses can be really good. You know, they can be good excuses. I'm out of money.
I got to shut down my business. Okay. Well, the guy who founded Brewmate sold his Yeah. He was sleeping in his car or something. I read one story about like you it's it's really the lengths that you are willing to go through. Shout out to another Indiana entrepreneur and I don't know him.
I just sto um so it's it's really the lengths people are willing to go to and I think at that point I wasn't I started falling in love with it along the way because I I mean really there was a point where I was like I don't even know if I want to do this but I have invested all this money like I'm not walking away from this this is going to work out I have no other choice just like I felt like at IU I when I put my mind to thing and a girl who works for me still today, Claire is like, "If I were on an island with somebody and we were in a desert in the middle of nowhere, I would pick you to be stuck on an island with because you are going to get us off that island." And I'm like, I will take that. But that's like the kindest compliment someone can give. That's probably my favorite compliment cuz I'm like, I just get really determined. So yeah, from there um we just kept reinvesting and scaled.
But yeah, my boyfriend ended up paying for that Top Golf and was like, "Look, I just want to go and his own birthday. And honestly, at this point, it's paid off. But he had to live in um there were papers everywhere. We ironed skirts in my kitchen dining room table for a long time. Wow. Now, here you are.
I mean, what you started the brand in 2019, 7 years later. Yeah. I count it like 2020 cuz I wasn't really putting in that much effort, but it did start in 19. So here you are, you know, some incredible accolades, you know, doing from the outside looking in, you know, is there a sense of stability here six and some change years later? Do you feel like I mean obviously entrepreneurship you can never can never take your eye off the ball, but do you feel like you can breathe a little bit? I feel like I can breathe in terms of the stability of the business.
I think as things have scaled and we, you know, over 100% year-over-year growth, it was like, you know, my first big year was 200,000 in sales, then it was 2 million, then it was 5 million, then it was 10 million, then it was 16 million. Like, it just that's insane. It keeps doubling. But I think like I think that it's become very difficult to you know manage that internally. It's been my life you know there were lots and lots of weekends. There were weeks that I worked 80 90 hours and I think that um it's now hard to manage a big team.
Um, but I think that we're, you know, we're stable in terms of business, health, and growth, but my life is just as hectic. And, you know, my brother told me early on, it never gets easier. And that was when I was like had zero dollars. I'm like, well, it would be nice. It would be at least easier if I could have some money like to pay the bills, but he's right. It doesn't get easier.
Um, it's just your problems are different. They change, right? Uh I think that's super interesting too of like sometimes founders come on and they talk about the skills required to go from zero to 100,000 or zero to a million are very different than what it takes to go from 5 to 10. Yes. Right. You talk about people man like there's no people to manage when you're going from zero to 100,000.
It's just like put your head down and figure it out. Right. The problems change team grows. You have to be you know you just flex more leadership muscles. Mhm. If you had to give advice to other entrepreneurs out there that are working to take that step from they're making money, but they want to unlock growth.
They want to figure out how to go from maybe the couple hundreds of thousands into hitting their first million dollar year. What would you say? You need to be willing to lose and try every outlet because there's no, you know, I've always said there's not one way to cook a pot of chili. So there's not a sing what there's a billion ways to cook a pot of chili. It really is. There's a multiple different good chilies.
They're all made in different ways. Um, so I mean, you better be be prepared to explore every avenue and be willing to fail over and over and over again. I don't have necessarily an answer on how to how to get there. You just need to be proactive and reactive and be able to pivot in any way. I think the the mental um component of it is important to stay focused and just continue to grind. Oh, failed.
Back up. Back up again. Just got to be active, proactive, react, all the activives. Just be active. Wow. Okay.
Um couple interesting accolades that I want to talk about. One, how did it feel to be honored as a Forbes 30 under 30 recipient? It felt really surreal because I had it on a vision board that was pinned up in my office for a couple years. And the same thing like my running career, it's like you never think I put it up there, you know, like, oh, I'll put, you know, somebody might put some crazy thing out there like a Lamborghini or like a $100 million whatever. And you know, kids when they're young may put being in the NFL, but they go on to have like a good college career. I put it up there because, you know, shoot for the stars, but I will say I think I've been realistic with things on my vision board in my dreams because I'm always like surprised I've gone and surpassed them.
So, it felt very It just felt very surreal and not believable. But, you know, it's around Black Friday and you're like, you know, sometimes it's hard to take a step back and be like, look at how far I've come. So, it was an amazing moment. I thought it was really cool. I mean, such an incredible honor. So cool.
The other one that's I mean, near and dear to Hooers here is uh you just dropped a collab with the Indianapolis Colts. I know. Now, you've been working with the Colts cheerleaders for a few years, correct? Mhm. But this is like you're licensed with the Colts pro like people can get apparel to support the hometown team this football season in collab with you guys. What's the process of putting it together a deal like that?
Well, I guess first off I think that was just as surreal if not more surreal because you know I grew up going to some Colts games with my dad and it's like the Forbes list. don't really know what that is, but you know, and as a side note, well, growing up, as a side note, they they were so impressed with Gold Hinge because I didn't have um investors. Like, they were like, "Wait, you're on a cash basis and you're not in Den, you have no investors." Like, that was why I made it there. But you don't really like process that. The Colts thing was more emotional of like, you know, I flash back to my old self like being 10 at the game and like you you would I would have never believed in a million years that that was going to happen.
So, we started the conversation with them two years before and classic. Okay. Um, you know, when it first got brought up, I'm like, "Oh my gosh, we need to make this happen." But, you know, we're we're working last second. we're still I mean we're the planned out the farthest we've ever been but uh you know they ended up saying I don't think this is going to work for this season how about the next year and in the time you know at that time how I'm operating my business I'm like that's light years away one year that is so far away like what if we're not even in business you know that's just a joke but um so then they c we circle back the next year and they're down to do it and I'm like oh my gosh this is great I really let some of my girls carry it out. Um, you know, they really gave feedback on the designs they wanted.
I had Addison handle the contracts and everything. And it really wasn't surreal until the collection came out and I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is awesome." I had low expectations, but then it sold out and I'm like, "Oh my gosh, this is insane." When did it drop? August 20th. It dropped August 20th.
Um, you know, our styles were so our numbers were so limited that I think we're going to do a restock and they sold so fast. They sold more than I thought cuz, you know, I'm going into it with realistic expectations. I've been down a million routes before where things didn't work out. And so, I wanted to have low expectations in my head. So, they really surpassed them even though everyone on the team's like, "It's going to do so well." And I'm like, you know, I'm setting myself up for reality.
And um you know I told the people on the team you know can't get an employee discount. We got if you want it you got to order it. I even joked that you know my husband texted me any discount codes. I'm like nope you have to order on fanatics full price. No way. Uh okay.
What were all the products in the line? So we have the Colts GH um it's our G it's our GH widearm sweatshirt. It's the speed blue that has you know Colts with the big letters. Yes. And then we have the um prep mock neck. And we have the that's a sweatshirt.
Then we have the Indianapolis Colts football club sweatshirt which all these designs are designs that I did. We really they were existing designs of gold hinge and they loved them and we went and made it into a new design with um yeah new designs there. And then we have the white day toight top. It's an athletic sleeveless top that has built-in removable padding and half zip with the horseshoe and our um motion cloud a-ine skirt in speed blue with the Colts logo too. So, five pieces. Talk about such a cool time.
So, one I will say to run a female owned brand with no investors that you've grown to incredible heights thus far here in Indianapolis. Then you're working with the Indianapolis Colts, which is paving the way for female NFL front office executives here in the state of Indiana in the NFL. So cool with the ers in top on top of all of that, we have one of the most recognizable female athletes in the world with Caitlyn Clark. Like it's just a culmination of like this athletic prowess that's happening in Indiana for females. Like I'm just like so proud to be a Hooer. Yeah.
Isn't that sick? It's amazing. Like, I'm fired up. And then we just did a collab with Homefield and dropped IU, which is very near and dear to my heart. Um, my sister-in-law is a freshman at IU and she sent me videos. Our stuff is available to buy through u homefield.
So, that was really exciting, too. Uh we had Connor on the podcast ear not super early in his career but like before this last phase of growth where they've like really really gone out and crushed it and what an inc another incredible entrepreneurial story again like the the passion he has one there must be something in the water in Bloomington like they just continue to pump out amazing entrepreneurs uh but just to be kind of like in a similar space yet so different you know what I'm saying like they are very much for the diehard sports fans, the shirts they put out like uh we did a whole thing around, you know, their Indy500 collection and then you see your like it's just like the aesthetic on here is like oh you know you have seen you know again I'm I'm sure I can't even tell if it was I'm sure I've seen Carly Gordon like rocking one of these pieces for sure and like that that had to be a surreal moment for you.
Yeah, Alex Cooper was wearing gold hinge on her Call the Daddy on Call Her Daddy episode with Winnie Harlo. And it's like I think you get a little bit desensitized to some of these things, bro. She is. Yeah, I'll have to pull up an image. It's kind of crazy cuz you just you get a little bit like, okay, you know, you're talking to some big people and PR and whatnot. And um yeah, how do you stay rooted in the amazing stuff that you've done?
Episode. That's a gold hinge set. We gifted it to her and then she wears it and posts a story on it on her Instagram. It's got the little gh and that's like that's the kind of PR you can't buy, right? And I mean you have to gift out, you know, people get upset about that. It's like these people have power and um you know it's it just is what it is.
Um you have to gift out like 100 200 pieces 300 500 pieces before it hits and it has to be good. You got to be willing to invest and lose over and over until it hits. I think that's a piece too where uh we talked with Craig Hughes the uh the owner of St. Elmo Hughes Culinary and a piece of PR that they could never pay for was getting mentioned in Pton Manning's retirement speech. Like, I'm going to miss a steak on game day uh at St. Elmo Steakhouse.
Like, but what people don't see is it's like an iceberg. Like, what it was years of good food, customer service, like it's years of building that to get to that. Yeah. I I wanted to say the final question there before we kind of wrap things up. How do you continue to innovate, stay focused on the future, but also take a minute, Alex Cooper, like Carly Ers Gordon, like the Indianapolis Colts, these incredible, incredible celebrities and athletes, and you know, you've had insane growth. How do you balance both like being content and happy with where you're at, but also focused on the future?
Well, Gabby already knows what I'm going to say. Um my one of my top lift and drinks is actually my top number one is futuristic. So you know people have been like what are you going to do when the pleated tennis skirts don't sell? I'm like you don't think I've laid awake at night not sleeping with my eyes like what am I going to do? What am I going to do? Especially um when I've seen things eb and flow.
Um I'm always thinking about what do we need to do to cover our bases in the future? What you know all our styles are going to sell out? Protecting my employees. Do we have enough cash flow? I'm always thinking about the future. So I think that's a very important thing to you know marketing is always changing you always have to be thinking ahead to be safe and um be ahead on everything.
So I mean that's every area of my business and you know to answer the second part uh I don't really take a step back and I would say that's not necessarily a good thing. Um, you know, I work with a business coach. Shout out to Lucian Associates, Brian Kbecki. But, um, Oh, Brian. Yes, he's great. Okay.
Well, Gabby introduced my assistant over here. She introduced me to him and we work with him. Um, he coaches me and um, you know, he recently had even told me that I need to, you know, take a step back sometimes and see what I've accomplished. I think it's so easy to get caught up. You know, everyone's going to say, "Oh, yeah, of course you need to do that." But it's so much harder said than done when, you know, you're in go mode all the time, rushing to hit deadlines, everything like that.
It's really hard to even take time to do that. But sometimes when I'm alone at the office or the warehouse and I just I like have a flashback to like, oh my gosh, I cannot believe I'm here right now and this is all my inventory. And so I think moments like that are helpful, but I definitely could be better about that. I think every entrepreneur probably thinks that way. Yeah. Uh but you again, you have to keep climbing the mountain and you got to keep going.
And honestly, what you guys have accomplished is incredible. Uh I I'm pumped up. I'm excited. Like this got me energized. Uh we have come to the end of the show where we talk all things Indiana before we wrap up here. So this question is brought to you by our friends at JC Hart.
They're a leader in creating enjoyable living experiences at apartment communities all across Indiana and beyond. Check them out at homejart. com. My question for you, why do you call Indiana home? I think Indiana's my home because it's shaped who I am. As silly as that is, I think, you know, the people here are not the same people that you'll find in um other areas of the country.
I think that um Indiana is where I struggled, but also had the biggest moments of my life. And um I don't know, it's all the little bits and pieces of affordability to make me get my business going, the opportunities, and yeah, it's just so near and dear to my heart. It's like no other place, and I will be here forever. It's not easy. It's never easy to build a business, but having a $1,000 mortgage definitely helps, right? or um my warehouse.
That would be three times more in California. I I love it. Uh we have a few final questions for you here that we ask every guest who comes on the show. So the first one, it's your opportunity to shed some light on a part of the state that more people need to be talking about. It could be a restaurant, a bar, a park, it could be a trail, could be anything. But I want to know what is a hidden gem in Indiana?
Maybe it's a known gym, but the Indiana War Memorial and like that downtown area near the library, it's a known gym, but I think people need to appreciate a little bit more and spend time there because I would just go and walk my dog. You know, the days when I was trying to build my business and whatnot, I would just It's great to just like walk up those steps and look around. And I'm a big believer in like thinking time and just time to process your thoughts. And so I love downtown in that area. That's that's from like the library through like the American Legion Mall, the war like that. And I would go walk up the war memorial all the time by myself and just I was always dropping packages off at that post office right across the street.
I mean I Yeah. I had to drive the post I had to drive the packages to the post office every day. So, I spent a lot of time um down that area. And the coolest way I saw that was for the Post Malone concert when he was for Final Four. They made it a venue. It was insane.
Like coolest thing ever. I almost think that shout out to North Capitol Avenue because that's where my first house was where Gold Hinch started and that's also the street that the Colts Lucas Doyle Stadium is on. And so that's near and dear to my heart. But um yeah, I love downtown area. Amazing. Two more for you.
One, uh this is where we source new guests for the show and learn about people that are doing inspiring things. Who's a Hooser we need to keep on our radar? Someone who's doing big things. I would say Brian Kaviki. Okay. He's the business coach.
Yes, he's my business coach. Why has has his uh I don't know, him being in involved with the business been helpful to you? because you know he's helped me with a lot of internal struggles that I have had you know that I've always like wondered am I doing the right thing and guided me a lot the past year and it's been insanely helpful and um I know he's worked with a lot of businesses around Indiana and farther out but um yeah it's been very life-changing to work with him. It's interesting to see when entrepreneurs make that investment into it's almost like a business therapist. I would say a lot of people compare it to that where you can like kind of air out all the grievances, kind of complain, bend their ear a little bit. I always lead by saying, "Look, I've worked with consultants before cuz I have, but he's different."
There you go. Yep. Brian, come on now. Final question for you. So your journey did start in southern Indiana, then it in Louisville, then to Bloomington, then up to central Indiana. Mhm.
So when you think about it, what it means to be a Hooser. You're a Hooser by choice. You could be building you could be building this e-commerce clothing brand on a coast. You could be in New York. You could be in LA. You could be in Miami.
You could be in Austin, Texas. I always dreamed I would be in some bigger city, but here you are in Indiana building this brand. The Hooers are national champions. You're building this incredible business. When you close your eyes and think about it, what is your favorite Indiana memory? I mean, honestly, probably going to the Big 10 Championship at Lucas Oil last year.
Yeah, that was really, really cool. I mean, like I said, my husband played um football there. has been a lifelong Indiana fan. We're both um you know IU grads and that was so special to see. Did you walk in there believing they were going to win? Um you know no I you know again I like to keep my expectations low.
I hoped but I was very prepared for us to lose. Got to set myself. That was the one that was the game I think that flipped so many people to say like, "Oh my gosh, I think the Hooers are for real." Yeah. Like the Penn State game earlier on, it was like a crazy last second win insane catch. It was like, okay.
And I went out to the Rose Bowl and that was surreal, too. I grew up with my mom's side being all Alabama fans and, you know, she also was a Ohio State. She went to Ohio State for grad school and she was from Ohio. So, you know, growing up and always having my mom cheer for the teams that were so good in football, Alabama and Ohio State, and it was always sad, you know, oh, IU. Um, it was just really cool to see. And, you know, my mom was cheering for IU.
She's like, I just want to see them win. So, heck yeah, it was cool. That's so that's so incredible. I mean, what a heck of a run. And the Hooers are back at it again this year. I know.
Wow. This has been such an awesome awesome conversation. It's been great to learn more about you, about the business that you've built and just your incredible resilience. If I could say anything, like you're a problem solver. Like again, that's what business is, right? You find a problem, you fix a problem.
And I think that the entrepreneurial spirit comes in all shapes, sizes, athletes, like the whole thing. It's so cool to see it all come together. And your story is is super inspiring. I think there are a ton of aspiring entrepreneurs out there that are like the golden age of e-commerce is over. Like you can't build a brand, you can't there's all these reasons. You're like everyone has a good reason why they can't be successful and it's up to you as the entrepreneur to figure out how to be successful, right?
And there's always going to be new challenges. I mean, things are always getting harder and changing and you just have to keep up with it. If people want to learn more about you, if they want to learn more about Goldhinge, how can they do that? um they can follow Goldhinge on Instagram. I have personal Instagram page and Tik Tok page where I try to post when I can about um things that are happening behind Gold Hinge. So I would say there and if you are looking for incredible I mean Christmas presents coming around the corner like this is awesome.
I look again not necessarily something that I would but like would fit my shape right but I I'm already seeing Christmas list form by checking out the website. So, keep up the good work and we'll talk to you soon. Thank you for having me. This show is made possible by our friends up at Sweetwater. Whether you're looking to start a podcast or take your content to the next level, click the link in the description to see all my gear recommendations at Sweetwater. If you want a behind-the-scenes look at everything we're doing across the state, make sure you follow me on Instagram and Tik Tok, Nate Spangle.
Thank you so much for listening and being a part of what makes the Hooer State great. We'll see you next time here on Get