tonight we're going to have a fireside chat with Heather hos who is the president of advisa and Kevin Bailey who is the CEO of dream fuel our first presenter is Heather hos you may know her from the get in podcast she was featured on recently we love working with advisa they've been partners of us of ours for years they have helped tech companies like exact target lessonly and of course companies all over the country those are just some of the hometown here as you may have heard of really focus on building better teams from leadership all the way through the culture of the entire company
they do a remarkable job so please help me welcome Heather hos to the stage and our next presenter is someone I have known for a very long time he was at one of the very first powder cake events 12 years ago we both over 64 and so we saw each other and we were like what do you do and we were both really into digital marketing at the time struck up a friendship I worked for his company then he worked for my company he has got his own company that he really scaled up working with companies all over the country including some very well-known Brands
like link squares go to market fund working with all kinds of high growth businesses helping them perform better and specifically focus on mental performance and we just did a entrepreneur survey with them so there'll be some data on that soon he might even have some stats he might preview here I don't know please help me welcome to the stage the founder and CEO of dream fuel Kevin Bailey [Applause] than as I said if you have questions please write them down or save them because we'll open this up we've got a lot better question askers than me here but I do have a few prepared so
I'd love to just Dive Right In could we just start though maybe for those that don't know Kevin do you mind just giving the elevator pitch on dream fuel sure yeah so great to be here Matt love what powder cake is doing love working with entrepreneurs and Founders and Executives on building these great companies that change the world so dream fuel is a mental performance coaching company we have a platform and some software used too but basically our job is to help entrepreneurs operate in a world that is extremely uncertain we never know what's around the corner we're always trying to innovate trying to do
less with more tons of scarcity If we're honest with ourselves we're trying to turn lead into gold and help them have a great mindset as they go through that I believe that entrepreneurs are under similar levels of pressure as professional athletes every professional athlete has a mental performance coach I think it's about time every entrepreneur does I love it it's a little early to drop the mic but that was like a drop the mic type of statement Heather I I know I gave a broad breast Strokes view of advisor but do you mind just sharing a little bit of what you're up to currently and
and some of the ways that you work with entrepreneurs and CEOs sure it's great to be here we exist to create effective teams leaders and cultures because we believe everyone deserves the opportunity to thrive at work so we all spend a lot of time at work and it should be a place where we're both cared for for and challenged to be our best selves and one of the things that we've seen especially in the last few years is leaders and managers are really struggling to figure it out a lot of them don't have the skills and on top of it the entire world of work
has been turned upside down so we get a lot of joy out of coming alongside executive teams and leaders in the trenches and helping them learn new skills and mindsets to be effective I'm so glad both of you do all that work and one of the things I appreciate about both of you is that you really bring vulnerability into the conversation you're willing to go there you're willing to create safe spaces so hopefully we can do a little bit of that tonight and I know we've been sharing stories over beers prior to this so we'll just lean into that energy Heather I know you were
an educator prior to taking the helm at advisa can you talk a little bit about maybe one of those moments where we're making that transition from educator to Leading a team yeah my early career I was a teacher and a principal and my passion is teaching and learning so that part of what I was doing was always a great fit it was when I took a behavioral assessment called the predictive index and someone sat me down and went through my profile and they were saying things to me like you're extremely risk oriented you're a change agent you like things to move quickly you have a
sense of urgency you're very comfortable with risk you don't like rules and every single thing that uh he was saying to me I was realizing that I was like a wilting flower in public education because that's a place where as a classroom teacher and even as a building level administrator you don't have a ton of autonomy and the world of Education blessed teachers those who are still in the profession it's gotten harder and more challenging but once I heard those words about how I was wired and motivated it was like I couldn't unknow it and that led me that the consultant who gave me that
readback on my predictive index I approached him after the session and said how do I do what you do that is what you just did for me is a gift and that self-awareness is magical and so that that was my entree into advisa that's very cool and Kevin you're no stranger to the world of high growth High Press startups was there a turning point for you that led you to go pursue a neuroscience degree MERS in neuroscience at that and really focus on mental performance yeah first startup that I founded co-founded you were involved in and it was a roller coaster ride grew really fast
fastest growing company in the state in 2011 and I was just a punk 26 years old or something once we got to about 100 employees I had my first kid and I started to feel the pressure and my mindset started to shift from one of abundance and natural optimism maybe to one of pessimism and I was lucky enough to run into two people uh a neuroscientist by the name of Diane pal and a uh mindfulness coach coach who was a former uh Vietnam fighter pilot who cared PTSD with meditation and both of them took me under their wing and taught me a lot of the
things that they knew they didn't work with any tech companies but easily able to see how this stuff was appli applicable to my role the executives in our company as well as the salespeople and the change in me I think was pretty noticeable for my friends and people like David Durant from Green Light were like hey what changed I was like I'm working on these two people and Neuroscience is crazy can you believe that you can change the way that you feel and the way you feel is the way that you work and show up for your team and blah blah blah and and then
I obviously went and and helped you with powder cake as I as I did those few Consulting engagements in the beginning once I came to Powder Keg realized that problem I was seeing it slingshot in my first company was ramp in the tech space and every founder was dealing with the uncertainty and it was putting a lot of a lot of negative mindsets into them then I was like I need to get serious about this and I like I need to go pursue a neuroscience Masters and still finishing that almost done that's pretty pretty tough but doesn't sound easy so why did I get myself
into but no it's amazing the beauty is that in the80s Tony Robbins and people like would talk about things and be like H this is what we're seeing and this is what we're feeling but now we have Neuroscience that backs up everything we do and it's testable especially with athletes and people like that the evidence is there if you're not using these tools then you're really missing out could you maybe share one thing that surprised you about Neuroscience that kind of changed the way you approached coaching or at least gave you some context of oh that's why that works I think the biggest surprising thing
is that you can completely control the way that you show up and feel that was a shock to me because I remember during the most stressful moments of my first startup would sit there I'd come into the office and I would be in a pretty catabolic destructive state of mind and I would just sit there and stare at my computer screen and get mad and then you were a lot of fun those days they called me Darth Vader um you're still friends so yeah oh no nobody experienced that and I remember when I was sitting there staring at my computer screen I was like I
remember those days where I was like felt like I was on top of the world and I could I was so quick I was had great wit and I was so inspirational I was like what the hell happened to that guy and then when I start understood uh some Neuroscience I started to understand that you can influence your physi you have to be able to influence your physiology your emotions and feelings and your thoughts once you can influence those four factors then you can show up however you want even when the pressure is incredibly high and you feel the weight of the world on your
shoulders you can show up how you want to and that's incredibly liberating and you can be in Flow State where you're more productive and you can lead From The Trenches the right way and there's just some tools you got to learn we'll definitely make sure we save some time for some of those tools but I wanted to talk a little bit Heather with you because you me mentioned predictive index was like your gateway drug into this whole world of of culture and building teams and understanding yourself and a big piece of understanding yourself you talk about a lot is emotional intelligence how do you see
emotional intelligence playing a role in the workplace when it comes to mental performance mental health and just good leadership you piggy backing on what Kevin was sharing about the pressure that you feel when you're trying to grow a business and you have people expecting things from you and I think as a team when we were coming out of the pandemic we came together and we all acknowledged we're feeling burned out and disoriented and disconnected and we were so we some of us read a book called burnout and by the ngosi sisters but one of the really powerful things in that book is that your emotions
have like a beginning a middle and an end and what can happen to us is we're so busy and we're so constantly on the go that we never let our emotions finish and so what happens is it's like a pipe and like all these half finished emotions get stuck and they're stuck in their it's a weird metaphor but we had been doing emotional intelligence for a long time leading up to that because of course we're human so everyone has emotion you either acknowledge them understand them and then harness them to be more effective in decision-making and relationships or you ignore them and then they eek
out in unhealthy ways so that had always been part of our practice but it was when we read that burnout book and I had this new understanding of oh my gosh the creating space to finish those emotions and come alongside leaders and give them a way to understand that number one but then number two what's really powerful about EQ is you can learn the skills there's 15 competencies and there's things you can actually do differently that will lead to more productive and healthier outcomes for your relationships and your role as a leader of people how do you see this playing out at some of your
clients without naming names I I imagine it's probably measurable the difference that this makes I know sometimes things like feelings and emotions can feel fuzzy but one of if there's one thing I've learned from having conversations with you and Kevin like this stuff is actually pretty measurable and noticeable even on the p&l it is one of one of the metrics that where you can see different es in how managers are showing up and engaging if many people are measuring employee engagement or doing best places to work when you can do ab test with these managers went through learning experiences that included emotional intelligence and they
got some coaching which is a really important part it's one thing to learn in the classroom but only 10% of our learning comes from like the workshop 20% comes from relationships and 70% comes from back on the job the environmental factors when you put coaching with that so yeah we've been able to see differences in engagement data differences in retention which managers seem able to engage and retain people over time and then tons of anecdotal evidence where you'll have employees saying about the CEO like he's a kind Kinder gentler human he's calmer or she's more connected to herself and to others those are really meaningful
those are really meaningful metrics even though they may not show up on the bottom line but even individuals that go through some of our programming themselves they will say this has changed my life not just my business which feels better than that yeah it's powerful absolutely Kevin one thing I know about you is it's that you're a data guy can you talk maybe even like pulling the thread a little bit on what uh Heather was saying you made the comparison to sports how professional athletes all have coaches why don't professional CEOs have coaches and of course Sports you're you're measuring stuff all the time and
I know a big part of your business is you've actually developed some software to help measure this can you talk a little bit about the ways you're measuring it and the way you think about it when you're coaching a CEO or any executive yeah I always like to say there's no tape measure for the mind if you're doing a physical fitness regimen if you're getting stronger you can measure that if you're getting if you're trying to gain size you can measure that or trying to lose weight you can measure that but these neural networks related to things like discipline and resilience and motivation Drive Etc
when you don't have a fmri technology that can just go in and measure those yet so yeah figure it out or whatever nurlink but R&D Department of dream fuel yeah not quite so yeah so we like to look at the pillars of mental Fitness like I just said which we look at is discipline Drive resilience vitality and a couple others and then just measure those we created a factoral analysis to to figure out what questions we need to ask to measure those and we just watch those over time through a piece of software we made called intrinsic it's beautiful to watch as people grow and
learn the tools resilience is important in the tech scene we get fire drills and knocked in the head and slapped across the face so many times the last three years have been really easy though it's a daily thing so if you can't bounce back quick or if you know maybe on sales or something there it's important for other departments as well it's you can't bounce back quick and you let the energy of the gut punch you just took influence your next investor meeting that next investor meeting is not going to go so well I think and get what you were alluding to in the beginning
like why is it so embraced in professional sports but not so much in business yet little growth mindset there yet I think it is because of the mental health stigma I think people are scared that if they work on this stuff they admit they're having a problem and they need some help that some maybe the investors or something like that will look down on them but the beautiful thing is we have some inv investors now like GTM fund Elevate jmi they take this stuff seriously too and they're implementing it their own staff so I'm seeing some positive indicators there that there's going to be positive
change in the sector but I think yes it's the on the field when you get The Yips everybody knows and laughs at you when you get the IPS in the boardroom it's only you and the investors maybe your Executives or co-founders or whatever that see it and nobody wants to talk about it but stuff can be avoided if you know what to do maybe give us one tactic or tip just got the gut punch you heard the investor not going to invest in in the round they they verbally committed but then they back I know this never happens but they verbally committed but they never
wire the funds you find out oh they're not wiring the funds what do you do to to coach a CEO in that moment when they've just discovered that information yeah so I like I said I always look at this from physiology emotions feelings and thoughts so I'll give you a couple things to think about and that and these need to be wired into your physiology or what we call habituated because if you don't do them automatically it's hard to remember to do them so there's you're rewiring the brain to do this stuff automatically the first thing is that you don't want to stop breathing you
want to keep breathing I know it sounds simpleton or something but the stress response comes in normally because we stop breathing you never seen those old cartoons and stuff where they like bear their fist something bad happens they tighten their fist and steam comes out their ears they're not breathing they get a red red face or whatever that's like the natural response to to what you talked about like a big stress event so if you can remember the simple thing just okay something negative just happened I feel my body starting to shift just breathe now and just start breathing it's going to feel very uncomfortable
and unnatural at first because you're going to want to not breathe rhythmically and smoothly you're going to want to be choppy and stop breathing so it's keep start breathing and then the next thing so that's physiology the next thing I like to do is relax my stomach because the stomach wants to tighten and the Vegas nerve is down there when that stuff tightens that also throws you in basically it's like turn turn the of cortisol on turning it up at least but so you relax your stomach another physiological thing you can do the breathing thing is first and foremost if I'm like really in it
relax my stomach and then then I like to end it with a cognitive reframe so this works at the thought level so I'll tell myself this is just an easy thing to say I say this when I get pulled over not that I ever speed mat go best thing could have happened in your head best thing could have happened and uh you've rewired your brain I I remember you had that at Powder King and it annoyed the crap out of me because something terrible would happen be like best thing that could happen I was just like not my respon not not really my reaction Kevin
but it was good the brain's like a subconscious mind's like a heat seeking missile for confirming your beliefs so when I say best thing could have happened it causes a subconscious then to dig it's a lot faster at processing than your conscious mind to dig in and try and figure out why is this the best thing going to happen typically it's going to be a lesson oh I learn not to do this in the future that's great best thing could to happen but it might also lead you to a more intelligent creative way to address the problem oh cuz the person who gave you the
bad news they're like oh Matt's not freaking out like I thought he would so they're like this is nice and then Matt comes around and says that's a great point but what if we look at it this way or what if we try it this way oh that's interesting so you keep you keep the vibe up a little bit and you're not letting cortisol come into the equation and then afterward you assess it and you learn what you learned but in that moment I call this holding form we got to hold form in those tough conversations or tough negotiations and if you can hold form
like you're in a heavy squat or something if you can hold form then you can control the conversation the way you need to in those situations and not become a victim of what's happening I love all of that and I I think there's some really good tidbits there holding forms are great almost like Mantra hold form you got warm-ups you got holding form you got cool Downs yeah I love that I love that and Heather I know you and your coaches at advisa work with leaders at all levels and I know that you we have all seen maybe even experienced firsthand cultures that have seen
maybe leaders reacting not in the way Kevin just described but leaning into the natural response which over time can create a chronic uh experience which leads to what someone might call a bad culture um which I I don't believe that they're a bad culture I just think there are some cultures that have taken a turn because leaders haven't had the tools in order to help themselves and therefore help their teams the question I'm getting to is how do you coach some of your leaders and how would you go about treating some not treating it is like treating but coaching a a team that maybe needs
to turn a culture around when it's not just themselves but the whole organization yeah it starts with really understanding that the culture of an organization is what most of the leaders do most of the time so the shadow of the leader is a real thing so helping EXE Ives understand that culture isn't this nebulous thing that exists out there that you have no control over it's actually a very real thing that can either be a competitive advantage that will attract the best and brightest talent to your organization and help you succeed and prosper or great people aren't going to want to stick around or they're
not going to want to come to work in the first place so first you catch their attention this isn't soft fuzzy stuff anymore there aren't enough humans to do the jobs So demographically speaking that's a reality so executives are starting to say and be open to the things you're doing too like it's time they're realizing that I need to pay attention to this and learn how to do it but it really starts once you get their attention and if they want to shift their culture it really comes down to what is what are the core values what are the mindsets and behaviors that will hasten
and enable your strategic goals so you do have have to lead them through an exercise where you we have a process that we take them through that leads to defining both core values and unpacking those into behavioral terms because you can say teamwork is a core value what does that mean right so you do have to unpack that so that there's a common understanding of what do we mean by these values those become the pillars of your intentional culture and then the next piece that's really critical if you want to shift the culture is you have to Define leader capabilities what do leaders need to
say and do around here to activate those core values and Achieve those goals so that clarifying those leader capabilities three to five we're not talking 10 things now we have the executive team bought in that how leaders behave impacts the kind of work environment that we create and I've learned over time you can't delegate carrying the culture you also can't really delegate leadership development it starts at the top and it starts with making sure that executive team deeply understands the role they play in it and that they claim it you've got to be a culture they're like just fix my team you f and I'm
like if you're not willing sorry for the news yeah if you're not willing to do the work with us actually we can't help you you can't just delegate it over to HR and tell HR to call advisa we're going to try to run it back up the flag pole that's great and I know are both leading companies both also parents and there's a little bit of and probably have some people leading companies and who are also parents in the audience what do you do to stay grounded balanced keep your mental health in check while balancing those two things and and maybe what advice do you
have for parent CEOs presidents Founders in the audience oh gosh yeah I am a parent I'm married I have three kids my oldest is a freshman at SMU University in Dallas my middle daughter is a junior in high school my son is a seventh grader so it's busy and I think one of the things that's really important about this whole how do you balance it all as a running a company and running a family the first thing you do is you say it's really hard it's not easy to do and on any given day some days I'm a much better CEO than I am a
mom or a wife other days I might be a better wife and mom than I am CEO so it's you really have to take the Long View it's not about keeping score every single day it's about having clarity about the kind of human that you want to be taking the Long View and specifically for me my faith is important to me taking time in meditation and prayer and spending time you know reading and journaling is a very grounding exercise for me I also I'm a former English teacher I love to read often times Executives get really caught up in Reading business books when CEOs ask
me what should I read I give them fiction recommendations or I give them a really great non-fiction book and the reason that I do that is because other human stories even fictional characters we are creatures from a brain perspective and how we've evolved over time who are drawn to story and when you can for so for me when I can um get into a novel and just experience life and Humanity through another person's eyes it's a really healthy way for me to get a perspective check um on myself do you have a book recommendation for the group gosh I should have been prepared for that
question um there's a really great book called The Assault um sounds pretty chill it's not chill um actually one of the things that I do too that is a a tip I I give parents sometimes um I love to read so it's easy but when your kids get into high school or middle school and they're they read for school I always try to get the reading list and just pick a couple because then you can talk to your kid about the book so the assault was a book that my uh now freshman in college daughter was reading and she was super into it so I
latched on to it but it's it's a World War II book but what happens is this family Witnesses a German U murder right in front of their house and they start to Panic that it's going to look like they did it so the Sun goes out and moves the body but then that anyway and it sets off this chain of events that transcends time and centuries but that's an amazing book that's a great recommendation yeah I want to yes an some Heather said yeah please um I recently became Catholic a few years ago and I learned about Sabbath is day of rest seven days take
a day of rest and I was like my Sundays don't look like a day of rest not at all I got four kids and I got a six-month-old right now and I really thought about it a little bit and like what would a day of rest actually look like as an adult with four kids and I thought about the Neuroscience aspects of rest and thought about us entrepreneurs we are dopamine machines we're all addicted to dopamine we move real quick we're super motivated we push push push it's I like fast cars it's like we're always pedal of the metal as hard as we can go
and that's dopamine and that creates a brain that's very dopamine dependent and solidifies those neural networks and just really pushes us there but serotonin is the balancing molecule to dopamine and some of the other feel-good um hormones dopamine is like a pleasure molecule serotonin's a happiness molecule but we don't get much serotonin believe it or not as entrepreneurs we're just incredbly driven and motivated and what I started doing and I had this is a challenge to you guys who feel that way that you're just always on start to remember what it was like when I was a kid on the first day of summer that's
a serotonin day or a snow day yeah or a snow day the best everyone we had to wait and watch the TV yeah so dopamine's go oh yeah yeah so dopamine's like goal oriented and time bound like soccer is dopamine and kid kicking a ball for the joy of it's like serotonin there's no time it's not time bound and there's no goals okay so it's like a seratonin day what would that look like and then I talked to my wife and I was like Hey what if you just gave me a day where I had no responsibilities at all to the kids or anything and
I could just do whatever I wanted I could wake up with the son go home when my mom called me in for dinner like a kid how would that be and she goes hell no and I was like and I was like and I was like what if I gave one to you too and she's so we started to trade we took a day every other week and we just dedicated to serotonin and just doing whatever the hell we want we don't do things that are real dopamine heavy like gambling and stuff we do things that are just naturally nourishing to the mind body and
spirit and can you list maybe a couple of those things just in case yeah sure so I so for me I'm trying to push the boundaries of what's possible for my own mindfulness and stuff so I get up in the morning pretty early I do so I try and you got to relax the mind the body and then the spirit whatever you consider that to be you give them the crazy Kevin Bailey version they they'll tone it down for their lifestyle yeah so I get up in I get up when I feel like it and then the first thing I do is I do a
little bit of chiong chiong is a way to nourish so to speak the energy in your body move the body around light exercise would work as well then I do progressive muscle relax relation to really relax the body and then I do a specific type of meditation to relax the Mind those things come together and I feel at a level of peace that is beyond anything I could ever experience if I didn't do those three things I use that to then go and enjoy maybe I hang out with my wife or go do something I just love like maybe go do something in nature maybe
go fishing or something just really chill and then I'll go have a long meal so maybe I'll go eat Chipotle in the sun listening to my favorite music just jamming out by the way my phone is a million miles from me you know like I'm not looking at any of that stuff again no goals not time bound and then maybe go do a light workout something I don't push it I'm not trying to set PRS but maybe go do a little strength training and then end the day around 4:00 pick my kids up and have a really nice long slow cooked meal with them that's
like a typical serotonin day for me I like it serotonin Sabbath day there we go good yeah I dig that but I'm serious I coach everybody on this it's we wait months to like or like half a year most entrepreneurs barely ever take vacations you do this every other week you got a day every other every few weeks you can look forward to doing whatever the heck you want and if you can coordinate again with your partner on it and it's just it's a beautiful thing to look forward to I highly recommend it and it keeps the we got we're run whether believe it or
not we're not doing sprints like this thing's a marathon You Want to Build and Grow and exit a company it's a 10year thing in most cas maybe you're lucky and you do it in seven years or something like powers or whatever but it's a 10 plus year thing that's a marathon you have to build the dopamine networks and the serotonin networks to be in harmony with each other if you want to be able to make that Marathon so you actually need it's uncomfortable at first and it feels weird why am I doing this you have to remember how to be like a kid again and
cultivate that when I do that day right it's like I'm hitting a Gong that will resonate throughout the next two weeks and I'll show up differently for my team and my family because that one day where I really got in that state it's like sometimes you meditate it holds for a little while that day holds sometimes for a couple weeks yeah I love that and I want to open it up to a couple questions if you all have some but I wanted to share one thing that you shared with me that I found really helpful and I've now shared that several times which is I
think it was maybe early pandemic you and I were catching up and it was like I'm just going from one thing to the next trying to make sure everything's in check people are getting paid team's getting taken care of I'm checking out the D list every day after day and I was in like a heightened state of everything being dopamine driven you pointed this out to me it's not like what I came to you with I was like I'm having trouble finding any fun true happiness I feel good about checking out the to-do list but the happiness part is gone right now and one of
the techniques that you showed shared to me I think you had done something similar was creating a to do a serotonin driven activity yeah and that's what I did I set a goal to play my guitar and write songs for 20 minutes a day and of course as long as you do it for 20 minutes like timer goes off there were a lot of days I I did it for like a whole hour and eventually what was really interesting about that is that dopamine driven oh I checked the box then turned into oh I just want to pick up my guitar like naturally and so
it was the Paradigm that I found really helpful from that was like using our natural wiring as CEOs to get done to make sure I'm getting done that is a serotonin inducing activity and now that that just happens naturally which thank you no problem I think I've said that before but I'll say it again here and I wanted to share it with you all I found that to be really helpful anyone here have a question we had time for a question or two if if you want these guys have it all figured out no concept one of the things that helps extreme athletes get into
flow state is knowing they could die it's one of the flow triggers so like a big wave surfer knows he can die so it helps him init because flow state is you're operating intuitively the critical mind is gone you're in you're all the best neurotransmitters in the world are running at the same time time so it's a beautiful place to be and there's it's it's a spectrum there's different degrees of flow I don't know it it depends on the life you want to live it comes down to that it's if you want to give yourself the impression that there is no backup plan and that
there is only this you can wire yourself that way if you want but I'm once you understand neuroplasticity you can learn how to rewire the mind to give you that mindset I think that's a thing that we don't understand as a subconscious ious controls 95% of our thoughts so if you want to feel like everything's on the line then work with somebody who can program your mind to believe everything's on the line and you'll show up like a pro athlete because you'll know that if XY or Z doesn't happen then these major problems are going to happen and in fact I mean just to pull
that thread a little bit further Andrew Huber is obviously a popular neuroscientist he talks about this too personally I don't go into this too much with people unless I really have to but start talking to yourself about all the things that can go wrong and play those out and and really start to to tell yourself if this thing goes wrong I'm in a really bad place it will increase performance the question is for how long until you potentially burn out that comes into play like me having good processes for rebuilding yourself is you put that much pressure on yourself but it's a really great question
I I can't answer it perfectly for you um but I think that's the thing is can you be on top of it and can you control it rather than a controlling you cuz fear of failure can cause somebody a lot of problems as well but if you're if you can if you're a puppeteer of your mindset then you can choose how you want to show up when you yeah yeah good points I really appreciate the question and you sharing it gave me a chance to look at my phone and realize where past time time flies when you're having fun we're in Flow State talking about
this this has been get in a powder kick production and we want to hear from you if you have suggestions for a guest or segment reach out to Matt or Nate on LinkedIn or on email to discover top tier tech companies outside of Silicon Valley in hubs like Indiana check out our newsletter at powder.com newsletter and to apply for membership to the powdercake executive Community Check out powder.com premium we'll catch you next time and next week as we continue to help the world get in since you just listen to this podcast you might be thinking about starting one for your company lucky for you our
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